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Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse that

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse that

#151

Post by dangus »

seydor wrote: post #147
NaOH wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The fundamental force behind this is individualism. Every single technological innovation has made it easier for the individual to function better alone. Every societal change has emphasized the individual right over the (real or perceived) benefit of the collective. This trend seems to accelerate and absolutely nothing that is happening in western society even remotely suggests a possible turnaround. I've long capt…

I m somewhat surprised that big cities still exist and people aren't killing each other or run away

Believe it or not, big cities have pretty good quality of life and people who live there do actually have friends and social lives.

I grew up in the suburbs, and I've lived in big cities, urban areas in medium sized cities, and exurbs as well.

The cities aren't as different as non-urban people think. But also, they're better in a lot of the ways that most people would expect: more things to do, better food, better shopping. The only real downsides in my mind are less affordable real estate and higher local particle pollution.

By far my least favorite lifestyle of those choices was in the exurbs/rural areas. Incredibly boring, isolated, and it's not as quiet and tranquil as one might expect (you're probably near a highway where jake brakes are allowed or a 55 MPH country road).

Believe it or not, city areas seem to have better quality park space (because what most people who aren't into hardcore nature consider to be "a nice park" is usually quite heavily designed and built).

And, oh yeah, cities are where the jobs are.

Re: Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse that

#152

Post by SoftTalker »

closeparen wrote: post #149
UweSchmidt wrote: post #125

The fundamental force behind this is individualism. Every single technological innovation has made it easier for the individual to function better alone. Every societal change has emphasized the individual right over the (real or perceived) benefit of the collective. This trend seems to accelerate and absolutely nothing that is happening in western society even remotely suggests a possible turnaround. You can take ac…

>Every single technological innovation has made it easier for the individual to function better alone This sounds deep and wise in the abstract, but I think it's important that we're talking about is, like, because there are washing machines now, you can show up places looking presentable without there being a woman in your home dedicated to washing your clothes all the time.

That was never necessary. You have always been able to pay someone to do your laundry.

Re: Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse that

#153

Post by ch4s3 »

NaOH wrote: post #138
UweSchmidt wrote: post #125

The fundamental force behind this is individualism. Every single technological innovation has made it easier for the individual to function better alone. Every societal change has emphasized the individual right over the (real or perceived) benefit of the collective. This trend seems to accelerate and absolutely nothing that is happening in western society even remotely suggests a possible turnaround. You can take ac…

>The fundamental force behind this is individualism. Every single technological innovation has made it easier for the individual to function better alone. Every societal change has emphasized the individual right over the (real or perceived) benefit of the collective. This trend seems to accelerate and absolutely nothing that is happening in western society even remotely suggests a possible turnaround. I've long capt…

> I've long captured this by saying that a society based around the individual is a contradiction.

I don’t personally seen the contradiction here. Mutualism is orthogonal in many ways to individualism. Even the lone hermit had parents, acquired the basic skills form somewhere, and probably uses some tool(s) made by others.

Individualists can take on any number of voluntary social obligations. The ability to exit destructive obligations is a safety valve, and makes the carrying out of those obligations more meaningful in some ways.

Narratives, customs, culture, and shared interests all bind people regardless of their place on the scale of individualism to collectivism.

Re: Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse that

#155

Post by dangus »

FooBarBizBazz wrote: post #127
torstenvl wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Presumably https://www.tesd.net/cms/lib/PA01001259/Centricity/Domain/11...

Bowling Alone was very well received when it came out, but there has been another thread of articles that have been more controversial. I believe a relevant title is: E Pluribus Unum: Diversity and Community in the Twenty-first Century The punchline has been that, if you are not careful, increasing diversity can lead to decreased trust in society, and with it, decreased social capital. The idea is that nobody feels r…

The key to avoiding distrust is by systemically avoiding segregation. There's nothing wrong with diversity itself.

Re: Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse that

#156

Post by bittercynic »

pbronez wrote: post #115
EE84M3i wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>have you tried the easy ones, like regularly inviting other folks over for a group dinner? Frankly, this made me laugh out loud. 1. Who am I going to invite? It's not like I have old connections to rekindle. 2. I have a tiny apartment and couldn't exactly host many guests. My table could theoretically sit four if I rearranged some things (the max it's ever had is 2) 3. Considering I'm not exactly a socialite now (It…

You live in an apartment? Who else lives on your building? In a decent sized building I bet you’re not the only lonely person. Find the other ones, and create some social thing that’s easy to say yes to. Dinner is straightforward. Other excuses include book clubs, movie viewings, crafts, community garden, volunteering, etc. For a dinner, if your apartment is small, use a common space. If you don’t have a common room,…

I think you are taking for granted a huge body of knowledge that some of us are lacking.

Hosting a dinner gathering is complicated. What foods do you serve? What time? Do you complete all the food prep before guests arrive? If you are chatting over appetizers, how do you invite your guests to the table for the main meal?

There's not just one right way to do these things, but if you're trying to host a dinner party for people who you're not already comfortable socializing with, each little thing can feel like "Am I doing this right? "

Re: Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse that

#157

Post by [deleted] »

FooHentai wrote: post #145
A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am posting this as a person born and raised in a rather small community. I personally do not yearn for the good old days when 'everyone knew everyone' and there were things to do together. We did things together, because of geographical convenience and random chance. We had no other options so we did kids things. Granted, I was lucky to be included in that particular group, because they all were much, much smarter…

Perhaps. But what are the long-term ramifications of continuing down this track? Does a society of individuals with low cohesion survive in the long run? What motivations to pull together and overcome any adversity that might come along exists? Is it worth it for a few generations of improved individual freedom, if that society doesn't hold together longer than that due to a lack of cohesion? “A house divided against…

[deleted]

Re: Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse that

#158

Post by dinosaurdynasty »

nullish_signal wrote: post #22
ilaksh wrote: post #11

A few thoughts: 1. The internet means we have many forms of entertainment available without needing to go anywhere. 2. Many of those are social activities, even though we are physically alone. This is completely different from being totally isolated (as implied by the article). 3. The declining economic situation affects the ability of people to pursue leisure activities that would involve actually going somewhere th…

"The bad economy means you can't meet people in real life. But soon, everyone will buy VR goggles and hang out on rented servers!" Am I mis-understanding something here? Just go on a hike, walking is free.

You actually meet people going out walking?

Re: Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse that

#159

Post by SoftTalker »

EE84M3i wrote: post #98
standardUser wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you go to the same bar all the time and haven't made friends there, try a different bar. And maybe consider those dates as opportunities to make friends in addition to romantic pursuits. A lot of my social group connected originally via dating apps.

I have some friends at the bar, and I'm definitely considered welcome as a regular, and always have a good time, etc. But they're mostly drinking buddies, and not much more outside of that, however I'd like to try harder to change that.

What do you imagine a friend is? Mostly they are drinking buddies, or buddies. I have not had a friend in over 30 years who was anything more than someone I knew from an activity we both did or a place we both frequented.

People (especially men) pretty much stop having "deep" friendships once they are adults.

Re: Americans are choosing to be alone, but we should reverse that

#160

Post by darkwizard42 »

seydor wrote: post #147
NaOH wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The fundamental force behind this is individualism. Every single technological innovation has made it easier for the individual to function better alone. Every societal change has emphasized the individual right over the (real or perceived) benefit of the collective. This trend seems to accelerate and absolutely nothing that is happening in western society even remotely suggests a possible turnaround. I've long capt…

I m somewhat surprised that big cities still exist and people aren't killing each other or run away

Big cities feel easier than ever to avoid the individualism trap in the US. Likely they have SOME public transportation, attract similar minded individuals, have vibrant social scenes involving food/drink and so make it easier to find friends and keep them.
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