Its like you can't be fired for buying Microsoft (as an IT purchase decision). You can't be fired for buying JIRA. JIRA makes everything, the most broken or dodgy processes look respectable. It keeps Managers and scrum masters busy. They have a toy to play with, and why not?, why should only devs have toys. I'm not saying I hate JIRA, or that it doesn't work. Its just that sometimes the tail wags the dog.
I fucking hate Jira
151–160 of 539 posts
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#152I feel like hating on Jira is the pastime that is now passed down from each generation of programmers to the next. I'm going to stick up for Jira. I certainly don't "love" Jira, though I do think they've made significant improvements with "new Jira" (I think they call them team-managed projects now). The problem I have with the incessant Jira bitching is that I rarely feel that bitchers have a true understanding for…
> why don't you think some other company has come along and toppled the Jira crown? Because it's really hard to kill off the market leader when the market leader is embedded into the core of how a company works. I don't buy that it's a matter of competitors not being better. It is more about inertia. The argument you have here could equally be applied to C++ or Cobol "Why is new code being written in these languages?…
>Because it's really hard to kill off the market leader when the market leader is embedded into the core of how a company works.
eh. I've experienced a number of painful tool and platform shifts in my career that basically came down to "it's cheaper" so I don't buy that companies are unwilling. If someone provides the feature set that is some combination of cheaper and better, then the only thing you really need is a migration path (Jira import tool in this case), and you'll be able to make some sales. Make enough sales and you start looking popular and that can provide its own inertia. The fact that this has not happened is, to me, evidence that nobody has done it better so far.
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#153I feel like hating on Jira is the pastime that is now passed down from each generation of programmers to the next. I'm going to stick up for Jira. I certainly don't "love" Jira, though I do think they've made significant improvements with "new Jira" (I think they call them team-managed projects now). The problem I have with the incessant Jira bitching is that I rarely feel that bitchers have a true understanding for…
> why don't you think some other company has come along and toppled the Jira crown? Because it's really hard to kill off the market leader when the market leader is embedded into the core of how a company works. I don't buy that it's a matter of competitors not being better. It is more about inertia. The argument you have here could equally be applied to C++ or Cobol "Why is new code being written in these languages?…
You mean as hard as when Git obliterated every other VCS within the span of a few years? If products are better, they get adopted. How do you think every single company in the world started to develop for iOS between 2008 and 2010? When the upside is obvious and the path to transition is well-defined, there is very little friction.
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#154I feel like hating on Jira is the pastime that is now passed down from each generation of programmers to the next. I'm going to stick up for Jira. I certainly don't "love" Jira, though I do think they've made significant improvements with "new Jira" (I think they call them team-managed projects now). The problem I have with the incessant Jira bitching is that I rarely feel that bitchers have a true understanding for…
I don't use Jira. I'm aware of what it basically is. We're small, we use a pin board, 3x5 cards, and a drawer.
Do open source projects of any size use Jira? If not, do they use a basic knock off? The few not-so-big ones I've contributed to seem to get by without it, but maybe I just don't have enough exposure with these. If the open source world can be semi-productive without Jira, I think that's telling. The interested student can decide the details of what it's telling.
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#155Not going to read this rant because of time. But let me guess. Jira is a giant time waster. My main problem with Jira though is that it takes a lot of effort to configure it in good way. Jira is a piece of software that comes with plain horrible defaults.
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#156Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I do think they've made significant improvements with "new Jira" (I think they call them team-managed projects now). I feel totally the opposite. If you've ever had to administer Jira at a large company than team-managed projects are the bane of your existence. If you think, there's even a small chance that your company will grow to 300+ engineers any time in the next several years then do yourself a favor and turn…
I upvoted your comment because I believe it's a perfect example of what I was trying to point out: it is impossible to please everyone with a company-wide project management tool, but the fact remains that it is a necessity. For all the people bitching about how Jira makes it hard to work like they want to work, their are folks like you who will complain that Jira makes it to easy to get around a company-wide standar…
> but the fact remains that it is a necessity
I am interested on why people think that.
It doesn't look like a necessity to me. Ok, in a medium company, with dozens or maybe a hundred or two people, centralizing all the workflow is probably cheaper and more productive than siloing teams. But in a large company the inverse can very easily be true.
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#157I feel like hating on Jira is the pastime that is now passed down from each generation of programmers to the next. I'm going to stick up for Jira. I certainly don't "love" Jira, though I do think they've made significant improvements with "new Jira" (I think they call them team-managed projects now). The problem I have with the incessant Jira bitching is that I rarely feel that bitchers have a true understanding for…
The problem with Jira is that it is checkbox software, designed to sail through the checkbox procurement processes that large organizations have. "It checks all the boxes!"
Because of this, it is basically jello. It is everything, and it is nothing.
It makes nothing simple, and encourages people to overachieve with the tool. If you overachieve with the tool, you will underachieve on what it is you're really trying to do.
This is why much simpler tools are better. They are usually free, or at least a lot less expensive, and they come with constraints that you have to live within. Usually those constraints prevent you from going tool crazy, and guide you to actually focus on getting work done instead of doing performance art with Jira.
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#158I feel like hating on Jira is the pastime that is now passed down from each generation of programmers to the next. I'm going to stick up for Jira. I certainly don't "love" Jira, though I do think they've made significant improvements with "new Jira" (I think they call them team-managed projects now). The problem I have with the incessant Jira bitching is that I rarely feel that bitchers have a true understanding for…
Yeah I've been defended Jira here in the past, too. My opinion is that Jira reflects the organisation that manages it. It's basically a whole lot of customizable UI and permissions hanging off a user-defined state machine. You can set it up so that individual teams can fully administer their own projects, or you can go all the way in the other direction and have centralized, locked-down management where you beg some…
The central problem with JIRA is that, once you've gotten beyond the overly customizable functionality and difficult-to-reason about permissions, and once you've managed to avoid organizations that go too far off of the deep-end and once you've finally found a happy simplicity in a kanban-ish board,
once you've done all of that, it is still unbelievably, unjustifiably, just incredibly and amazingly so very very goddamn slow.
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#159I think Jira development is secretly supported by Microsoft to make sure there's always at least one enterprise software product that developers hate more than Windows
Re: I fucking hate Jira
#160I’ve used it at three companies and thought it was fine. Maybe my tastes aren’t refined enough or something but I thought it was fine.
Confluence is terrible but that’s a different product.