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When I made another Monkey Island

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Re: When I made another Monkey Island

#151

Post by Tyr42 »

seba_dos1 wrote: post #68
jaimebuelta wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The interesting bit about this kind of games is that you don't need state-of-the-art tech, and art at this point is mostly about choices, not necessarily about what's technically feasible. The best example is the usage of orchestral music, according to the post. I mean, for an 2D adventure game, you are basically animating characters. The objective is to create something like an animation movie, in whatever art style…

> and art at this point is mostly about choices, not necessarily about what's technically feasible. The best example is the usage of orchestral music, according to the post. Usage of real recorded instruments can still be technically challenging today if you want to do what Monkey Island 2 did with its audio via iMuse - synchronization between music and in-game events (easier) and smooth background music transitions…

One interesting innovation is in Octopath traveller. It has set up the music before the boss fights where it is ready to jump into the boss theme at any point you finish the dialog boxes.

https://youtu.be/b7Zc3f8cPnU?t=215

Re: When I made another Monkey Island

#152

Post by pcthrowaway »

stuckinhell wrote: post #64

I just played thimbleweed park, and yikes what a horrible ending. I'm very worried about Monkey Island now. Some authors NEED editors. I think Ron Gilbert needs the original team to help him on what works and what doesn't. Even the original Chrono Trigger was going to be super depressing, if the original writer had his way on everything. I would have hated his version of it.

I haven't heard this (and Chrono Trigger is my favorite game). What was the original ending supposed to be? "...but the future refused to change"?

Re: When I made another Monkey Island

#153

Post by technovader »

seba_dos1 wrote: post #148
technovader wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The new game isn't 3D, you're right. At least from the trailer I can assume so. But I wouldn't rule it out completely. Let's see when we actually get some gameplay. But it still feels like a major downgrade to Curse of Monkey Island or the originals. It looks like every other game, very generic style. It's lost the charm of the original games IMO. I think Ron has an opportunity to differentiate his game from all the…

"All the bad sequels"? From all Monkey Island games, I'd say only Escape could be considered somewhat bad. It felt rather uninspired compared to others, control scheme was awful and it aged the worst way of all MI games. All the rest are really great. Monkey Island series has been drastically changing the art style in its every single installment. When it comes to this new style, I find it hard to judge from still un…

I don't know how anyone can see a Monkey Island 2/3 screenshot, and compare it with this abomination, and say "it looks fine"

Monkey Island 2 was a gorgeous work of art. Every scene was worthy of being a wallpaper.

This trailer looks like something out of Teletoon / Cartoon Network. It's a style that is clearly lazy / easy / cheap.

Re: When I made another Monkey Island

#154

Post by wtetzner »

munificent wrote: post #140
Biganon wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been thinking about that quite a lot, but with Zelda games. I've come to the conclusion that the old games feel beautiful and mysterious and nostalgic because I played them as a child . I'm no longer a child, life is no longer the same. It's not necessarily worse, it's just fundamentally different. I will never blame Shigeru Miyamoto for that, it would be absurd.

There is a large component of that, but it's not just that for me. Minecraft evokes much of that sense of magic and wonder for me and I didn't start playing it until my later 30s. Other key components are: * A world that is interactive enough to feel like a place where you are and not just imagery that you're skimming over. * Art that is detailed enough to be evocative but not so detailed that it reaches the uncanny…

I think this is a big part of why I still enjoy playing Morrowind more than pretty much all newer open world games.

It felt like you were really in a place, and the lack of HUD directing you to "points of interest" made it that much more exciting and interesting when you discovered something new.

Re: When I made another Monkey Island

#155

Post by stuckinhell »

pcthrowaway wrote: post #152
stuckinhell wrote: post #64

I just played thimbleweed park, and yikes what a horrible ending. I'm very worried about Monkey Island now. Some authors NEED editors. I think Ron Gilbert needs the original team to help him on what works and what doesn't. Even the original Chrono Trigger was going to be super depressing, if the original writer had his way on everything. I would have hated his version of it.

I haven't heard this (and Chrono Trigger is my favorite game). What was the original ending supposed to be? "...but the future refused to change"?

http://www.chronocompendium.com/Term/Supporting_Material_Tra...

https://www.pressthebuttons.com/2014/10/lost-chrono-trigger-...

Re: When I made another Monkey Island

#156

Post by technovader »

ykonstant wrote: post #56
rob74 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What was special about the first two Monkey Island games (at least for me) was the atmosphere . I mean, just look at this screenshot: https://www.adventurecorner.de//uploads/images/games/monkey1... Parts 1 and 2 had this effect on me, with part 3 the magic was mostly gone unfortunately. If Return to Monkey Island manages to recapture some of that, I don't care if it's pixel art or whatever else...

Oh! I am glad to see the atmosphere aspect of MI emphasized! I played these games as a preteen, and much of the humor went above my head (non-native speaker). It was the atmosphere, the setting and the characters that made me love the games, especially the first one. I spent so much time on Melee Island; the eerie forest, the voodoo lady, the jail, the docks... these places and people made a tremendous impression on…

Fortunately Michael Land has made the music for every Monkey Island game yet, and is also onboard to do the music for this one

Re: When I made another Monkey Island

#157

Post by causi »

bnralt wrote: post #94
darkwater wrote: post #12

When you read posts like this, and also the previous, linked one [1], you can clearly see that Ron is a smart and humble guy. I really dislike the fan mob that it's starting the hate because RTMI is not going to be a throwback and retro-game. > Monkey Island 1 and 2 weren't pixel art games. They were games using state-of- the-art tech and art. This is SO true, and as much as I loved those games, as much as I stopped…

> I really dislike the fan mob that it's starting the hate I looked into responses to the announcement (on YouTube, Reddit, various forums), and didn't find any example of a "fan mob that it's starting the hate." Just about all of the top responses were extremely positive. I only found a small minority of comments saying they don't like the art style, and they're all pretty tame. For example, sorting by controversial…

I like the look, and I think it's better than, say, Monkey Island HD. I do see why someone might not like it. The new art style is extremely contemporary and basically looks exactly like every cartoon show of the last five years.

Re: When I made another Monkey Island

#158

Post by WorldMaker »

halostatue wrote: post #92
speeder wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually from what I heard they DID flesh out things. But then they made the serious error of hiring Rian Johnson AND giving him free rein with the direction of the movie. Rian Johnson already stated himself, he likes making divisive films. He also stated he doens`t like Star Wars... So he proceeded to ignore the plans that they had, and just do whatever he wanted. 1. He ignored several planned story arcs and just sh…

I find Ep 7 to be mostly unwatchable because it’s almost all fan service without a real story to be found. There was no plot for Ep 8 to hang itself on, just a few coathooks widely spread. Ep 8 had some really interesting character arcs, but also made some basic errors. As a movie , I think that it’s the strongest of the three sequels. Given a lack of plot points to really hang off, Johnson seems to have done somethi…

Abrams stated in more than one interview that he didn't know Star Trek much beyond Wrath of Khan and wasn't much interested in Star Trek. Star Trek to JJ was always just the audition for Star Wars.

He proved he was great at nailing the aesthetic even if so many other qualities of the franchise like writing and plot take a back seat.

That's basically his Star Wars movies in a nutshell too: he absolutely nails the aesthetic 100% and everything else suffers. I think that's why they feel so much like fan service rather than standalone efforts because of that uncanny valley effect where they feel so much like old Star Wars movies and don't have great ideas but to ape old Star Wars plots, but still aren't "Old Star Wars". A lot of what was new in the films added greatly to the aesthetic of the franchise and pushed that, at least, in new directions.

Honestly, I think "the Emperor has returned somehow" is pure 100% Star Wars aesthetic, too. Weird cloning nonsense: very Star Wars. Evil villains returning at surprise hours after being silently behind the curtain for movies: very Star Wars. Absolutely the writing could have done better of foreshadowing that than by doing it in Fortnite of all places (!), but it's still very Star Wars to just "oh, here's the Emperor now". The new trilogy "rhymes" with the original trilogy: Snoke like Vader is clearly a Lieutenant of someone else (and turning out to be a broken clone of the Emperor, very Star Wars) and then Vader/Snoke are revealed to be less important and we fight the Emperor directly. The only missing is the "I am your father" bit for Snoke, but we all know how corny Rian Johnson thought that was, despite being the exact sort of soap opera (well, pulp serial) plotting that made Star Wars what it was/is.

Re: When I made another Monkey Island

#159

Post by the_af »

practice9 wrote: post #101
interpol_p wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the atmosphere is quite there in this new one, here's Melee Island from The Verge's screenshot. The art doesn't sit well with me: https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/dQbYIfWFh5WfWwby87FoHyI8uog=... In the modern version the town is no longer twinkling and glittering. It appears smaller due to the large buildings. The strong purple tints (especially on the horizon) gives the scene an uneasy feeling. And the…

The old art feels, in a way, more realistic. One underappreciated aspect of low definition graphics is that your mind can interpolate the visuals, and you feel more immersed. (suspension is disbelief has a positive effect here) When graphics become HD or closer to photorealistic they are starting to trigger an uncanny valley effect.

> One underappreciated aspect of low definition graphics is that your mind can interpolate the visuals

Yes, what Scott McCloud calls "closure" in Understanding Comics.

That said, my mind also interpolates the newer version of Melee Island, because it's cartoony and "abstract" enough, and so I also like it.

Re: When I made another Monkey Island

#160

Post by Keyframe »

Biganon wrote: post #95
rob74 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What was special about the first two Monkey Island games (at least for me) was the atmosphere . I mean, just look at this screenshot: https://www.adventurecorner.de//uploads/images/games/monkey1... Parts 1 and 2 had this effect on me, with part 3 the magic was mostly gone unfortunately. If Return to Monkey Island manages to recapture some of that, I don't care if it's pixel art or whatever else...

I've been thinking about that quite a lot, but with Zelda games. I've come to the conclusion that the old games feel beautiful and mysterious and nostalgic because I played them as a child . I'm no longer a child, life is no longer the same. It's not necessarily worse, it's just fundamentally different. I will never blame Shigeru Miyamoto for that, it would be absurd.

I'd agree with you completely if I hadn't played Breadth of the Wild. It somehow managed to bring that child back and front again.
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