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Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

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Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#151

Post by bastardoperator »

yeetsfromhellL2 wrote: post #22

As a longtime armchair attorney who has closely read summaries of cases like this on Slashdot for well over the past decade (IANAL, BTW)...you could go the lawyer route but this basically amounts to your kid being a minor in school which means they don't have full legal rights, and the interpretation of 4A is likely up in the air here anyway. Constitutional rights don't necessarily apply at school or anywhere near sc…

The lawyer route makes no sense, it's all about small claims here. Sue for the cost of the chromebook, that will get someone's attention and you can likely settle it out of court or get the money to purchase a new one.

The important part here is that the computer is not usable with their software and that you have no way to remove said software despite being the owner of the computer.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#152

Post by mdmglr »

quadrifoliate wrote: post #116

> I bought him a Chromebook for schoolwork, but also for other private things. When we logged in... This is why you need to pay attention to the technology choices that you make, and that your schools make. Chromebooks are designed from the ground up to be locked-down dystopian spyware once you "log in" to them with a specific Google account. For heaven's sake stop buying any more Chromebooks. The correct solution he…

> Call into the school's board meeting during public comment, and make it loud and clear that the school is installing spyware on students' Chromebooks. Share your technical credentials and the method by which you found this. Emphasize stories of previous data breaches involving educational companies [1],

This is some bad advice. No need to escalate the situation. Simply contact the sons school and find out who the technologist is and ask them for help. Explain to them the situation and I'm sure they will understand. The computer is personal so they don't want it under mobile device management.

I have some experience with schools. The school is not intentionally installing spyware. Further most public K12 organizations have IT departments are not going to be as well staffed/knowledgable as your average silicon valley tech company. So they may not know exactly how to rectify this situation. No need to berate the school board over "spyware."

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#153

Post by cmiles74 »

If it was me, I'd write the Chromebook off as now being solely for school use. Your child needs to log into it with their school account in order to participate and complete their schoolwork, I don't see any way around this. As soon as the school account logs in, I believe the machine is then enrolled as a managed device of your school district.

Maybe you could get the school to supply you with a Chromebook, if you really want one. Where I live this is how it works (the school supplies the Chromebook).

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#154

Post by tragictrash »

fn-mote wrote: post #30
tragictrash wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's now a managed device and that won't help. If he power washes it, I believe it's still locked down to the school, I could be wrong thought.

There's a separate provisioning process for the "very locked" state you're talking about, not just signing in on the device.

Ah neat, thanks!

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#155

Post by gentleman11 »

yeetsfromhellL2 wrote: post #22

As a longtime armchair attorney who has closely read summaries of cases like this on Slashdot for well over the past decade (IANAL, BTW)...you could go the lawyer route but this basically amounts to your kid being a minor in school which means they don't have full legal rights, and the interpretation of 4A is likely up in the air here anyway. Constitutional rights don't necessarily apply at school or anywhere near sc…

Can’t you file criminal charges over this? It’s malware used to spy on minors without the parents knowledge or consent. Is the school also free to undress the kid and photograph them in person? If not, why if it’s remote?

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#156

Post by serf »

op00to wrote: post #147
quadrifoliate wrote: post #116

> I bought him a Chromebook for schoolwork, but also for other private things. When we logged in... This is why you need to pay attention to the technology choices that you make, and that your schools make. Chromebooks are designed from the ground up to be locked-down dystopian spyware once you "log in" to them with a specific Google account. For heaven's sake stop buying any more Chromebooks. The correct solution he…

Please don't follow this advice. Frothing at the mouth about spyware on your kids computer will immediately be dismissed as insane ravings, and possibly get a visit from your local child safety organization. I recommend reaching out to your child's teacher, and ask to get connected with the IT team at the school to explain what's going on.

>Please don't follow this advice. Frothing at the mouth about spyware on your kids computer will immediately be dismissed as insane ravings, and possibly get a visit from your local child safety organization.

I don't think parent described 'frothing at the mouth', and furthermore the concept of "I shouldn't speak out otherwise I may paint myself as a target for child protective services" is so subversive and nu-speak like that I don't think I can ever support it. CPS is supposed to be a social service for the support of children; not a society control and opinion-steering organization.

If parent did something publicly that'd warrant the visit, sure; but creating public awareness of the situation for the parents can be done in an orderly and respectful way -- no one suggested otherwise.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#157

Post by oriki »

MereInterest wrote: post #132
ac29 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isnt this the same way Windows works? If I sign into a work Windows account and they want to set my default browser or something, thats absolutely something they can do. ChromeOS isnt doing something particularly new in that regard.

On a Windows account, a user can change the default browser for their own account. Therefore, a user can delegate the choice of default browser to the remote management. A user can record which sites their own browser visits. Therefore, a user can delegate that authority, allowing remote management to record which sites that user visits. A user does not have the authority to record which sites are visited by another…

This is with the presumption that the filtering here is device-level and not user-level. The fact that they were able to wipe and reset the device AT ALL probably means that the device isn't fully enrolled into device management (only the account is) and that the blocking and monitoring is just for that one specific account/profile. That is to say, none of the blocking is breaking the privilege rules on the system.

This isn't to give them extra credit. GoGuardian is still spyware and you should be, at the very least, wary of it if you have a kid with that software running around. But this behavior is consistent with the design of ChromeOS and isn't shocking or special if you've been paying attention to what ChromeOS has been built for over the last couple years.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#158

Post by magicalist »

mfreydavis wrote: post #86

I work for a school district (not CPS) with about 2000 deployed Chromebooks and you're likely running into one of two things. 1) You somehow 'enrolled' the device into the Chromebook management. This is hard to do by mistake but if you do, essentially puts the device under the control of the school district. It also uses up a license on their end. We only allow particular IT only accounts to enroll devices. 2) You're…

This response should be higher instead of the useless armchair lawyering :)

With GoGuardian, though, I think device level management is common? It's BYOD but it essentially becomes the district's device (and all the other accounts disabled) until you remove the managed account. It can't happen by accident, though, it tells you very clearly you're making it a managed device.

It sucks that schools are using enterprise management to monitor every thing a student does on their machine, but it's not a rootkit or something. If it's not the district's device just remove the account.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#159

Post by mdmglr »

yeetsfromhellL2 wrote: post #22

As a longtime armchair attorney who has closely read summaries of cases like this on Slashdot for well over the past decade (IANAL, BTW)...you could go the lawyer route but this basically amounts to your kid being a minor in school which means they don't have full legal rights, and the interpretation of 4A is likely up in the air here anyway. Constitutional rights don't necessarily apply at school or anywhere near sc…

It's comical how your best advice is seek a lawyer. Any lawyer worth their salt would advise to contact the school directly to handle this matter. No need for a lawyer at this stage.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#160

Post by cmiles74 »

js2 wrote: post #17

It seems like you should be able to sign out of the CPS managed account, then use "Add Person" to add a non-CPS managed account: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1r7xOL4U9lL0qyqMIVl4eH2EM... https://support.google.com/chromebook/answer/1059242?hl=en&r... For school work, login to the CPS-managed account. Otherwise login to the personal account.

The surprising part to me is that the school district let parents bring their own Chromebooks. Where I live the school supplies the Chromebook for the students. If your child breaks it, they bill you for the cost of the unit and then supply another one. IMHO, they are pretty dang cheap.
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