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Alcohol-related deaths spiked during the pandemic, a study shows

nytimes.com

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Re: Alcohol-related deaths spiked during the pandemic, a study shows

#151

Post by psychlops »

emerged wrote: post #143
psychlops wrote: post #130

I notice that "the pandemic" is quickly found as the root cause and no analysis at all is done to identify if the response to the pandemic is to be implicated as well. I'd wager that waking up one day and discovering that one's job is not essential might be stressful. Being forbidden from going to the beaches and parks might have contributed. The stress of learned helplessness from countless bureaucratic decisions la…

Well you clearly didn’t read the article because the entire thing is talking about all of the sorts of causes you listed.

I disagree. The thesis reads "but the full impact of the pandemic’s collateral damage is still being tallied". The point above was regarding the response to the pandemic being considered as equal or greater contributors to the rise in alcoholic deaths.

The failure and successes of the response should be distinctly studied to determine a better course of action for the next pandemic.

Re: Alcohol-related deaths spiked during the pandemic, a study shows

#152

Post by dazc »

atchoo wrote: post #126
dazc wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He would buy his drink daily, not always from the same place and not at the same time. So some days he'd buy a bottle of cider, other days a bottle or two of wine, a bottle of spirit, etc. In other words, his alcohol consumption was erratic and the fact he had to go out and buy it everyday sometimes led to unintended outcomes such as mixing with the kinds of people with similar issues, having small accidents, being r…

Hmm. How much experience do you have with alcoholics? To me this sounds very naive. I have seen various forms of well meaning enablement that follow this exact pattern. The drinker still buys drink for themselves on top of their "ration" while maintaining a facade of moderation for the one buying them drink. If someone is meeting them a couple of times a week, then they plan bigger binges around those visits. I have…

Well, I did point out that he isn't a full-blown alcoholic which is a big difference to the kind of issue you're alluding to.

I did have the dis-pleasure of living with a proper alcoholic many years ago and she was exactly the type of person to have hidden stashes around the house. Alas, she was also the kind of drinker who needed to hit rock-bottom before she would even accept she had a problem and nothing I could do would be of any help to her.

She was a 'functioning alcoholic' able to hold down a job, be presentable and sociable. Also clever and devious enough to hide her problems from others to the extent that I left the relationship being perceived by others as the bad guy.

So yes, your points accepted but for the naivety on my part.

Re: Alcohol-related deaths spiked during the pandemic, a study shows

#153

Post by clsec »

darthrupert wrote: post #36

I'm more and more convinced that people who don't have kids should have double the tax burden compared to parents, at least for the first 5-10 years. The stress is unimaginable, and then some people have the gall to complain when parents try to do it well. Appalling behaviour. I would not tolerate such complaints as a manager, but thankfully I have never met such attitude in my life.

Why should my decision to never have children be taxed at all? My carbon footprint is a hell of a lot smaller than most.

Re: Alcohol-related deaths spiked during the pandemic, a study shows

#154

Post by SketchySeaBeast »

gitfan86 wrote: post #144
subungual wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not here to proselytize about your lifestyle choices, and I've certainly enjoyed my fair share of smoking and drinking myself over the years. That said, as someone who works daily with patients whose health has been destroyed by excessive drinking or pretty much any level of smoking, it's always been striking to me how surprised people tend to be by the results. A lot of people performing the calculus of "eh, what's…

The problem with the people you are talking about is that they didn't cut back as soon as they started to have minor medical problems. Having 4 drinks a day for a couple years in your 30s doesn't cause permanent liver damage that will kill you. But continuing to have 4 drinks a day AFTER being told that you are overweight and have elevated blood test results due to drinking can kill you. This becomes even more import…

I think that's assuming a lot about people to be able to quit cold turkey and being able to adequately identity the first sign of health issues. They've been dealing with health issues from their choices this whole time - if you're smoking you have a cough and your hands and teeth are yellowing, if you drink you wake up feeling like crap, so drawing the line at "as soon as they started to have minor medical problems" isn't really clear-cut. When is it a few extra pounds and when is it a beer gut?

Re: Alcohol-related deaths spiked during the pandemic, a study shows

#155

Post by ponow »

elliekelly wrote: post #136
sjg007 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Has he tried antabuse or something like that? Those pills make you vomit when you drink and are quite effective in harnessing the body's natural anti-poison response system to curb drinking.

For some reason we, as a society, have decided certain health problems are moral failures to be treated with shame and cured through willpower alone rather than modern medical intervention.

"For some reason" there are temptations to addiction all around us, and alcohol is only one. We can't treat being human as merely a medical condition. Human cultures have adapted using shame as a tool.

Re: Alcohol-related deaths spiked during the pandemic, a study shows

#156

Post by croon »

moritonal wrote: post #55
dazc wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a friend in the UK, similar situation. After years of receiving no help I took it upon myself to figure out what was causing his self-sabotaging behaviour. I can't say I made any great discoveries other than figuring out his trigger points and devising strategies to avoid them. Obviously everyone is going to be different but my friend's issues stem from being lonely and isolated a lot of the time. Simply me be…

Could you expand on "I found that ensuring he always has a supply at home has helped with this too"? I guess you mean that when they'd go out to a pub or bar they'd spend too much, which means that social pressure of embarrassment and bar-staff weren't effective controls. Did the extra money spent add to the pressure? What I'm curious at is that makes it sound like they're somewhat controlled within their home, or ju…

Not GP, and not battling any major addiction (luckily), but this reminded me when I got fit/lost some weight (~20 pounds or so) a decade ago.

I simply (not easily) cut out snacks (candy/chips/sugary drinks/etc) but my main vice was ice cream. So I kept a pint of my favorite kind (mint chip) in the freezer. I don't know how I got the idea, but my reasoning was that it gave me a singular focus on what to avoid, instead of navigating 50 traps, there was just 1. If I was at the store I didn't have to be tempted by anything as I already had my favorite at home.

No idea if it is the same idea as GP describes, but it reminded me.

Re: Alcohol-related deaths spiked during the pandemic, a study shows

#157

Post by after_care »

hackeraccount wrote: post #104

I am so glad I got married and had a kid. My wife doesn't drink - and honestly it's way less fun to drink - even have a glass of wine with a meal - when someone else isn't. Plus with my daughter I don't drink when my wife isn't around because I'm always worried something is going to come up and I'll have to drive her some place on short notice. I think if it were just me on my own I might drink more ... and I always…

Always having meals with the same people, being consistently worried you’ll be responsible to drop what you’re doing on short notice to drive someone. I’m glad I did not marry or have kids.

Re: Alcohol-related deaths spiked during the pandemic, a study shows

#158

Post by sokoloff »

IfOnlyYouKnew wrote: post #28
dijonman2 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regardless of which side you’re on I think everyone needs to be willing to engage in civil discourse. We’re more divided than ever and should actively work to fix it. It’s true that some people are anti lockdown and there may be merit. There may not be. The truth is we won’t know for a few years until we have more information.

No, the truth is immediately apparent, and the post you're replying to is mentioning part of it: we know how many people died, and have good enough data on causes. Lockdowns caused some deaths, with alcoholism being part of it. It also saved quite a few lives by reducing the number of traffic accidents. And no matter how you slice it, nothing comes close to the number of actual COVID deaths, let alone the number of d…

> [Lockdowns] also saved quite a few lives by reducing the number of traffic accidents.

Not in the US, they didn't. Traffic deaths in 2020 were around 7% higher than in 2019, after a multi-decade general downtrend. There were more traffic deaths in 2021 than in any year since 2007.

Final tabulation isn't ready for 2021, but from the first 9 months' figure 2021 was on pace to be materially higher than even 2020 was.

Re: Alcohol-related deaths spiked during the pandemic, a study shows

#159

Post by _jal »

ponow wrote: post #155
elliekelly wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For some reason we, as a society, have decided certain health problems are moral failures to be treated with shame and cured through willpower alone rather than modern medical intervention.

"For some reason" there are temptations to addiction all around us, and alcohol is only one. We can't treat being human as merely a medical condition. Human cultures have adapted using shame as a tool.

> Human cultures have adapted using shame as a tool.

A rather poorly targeted and counterproductive one.

Note that you immediately assumed a puritan view, that addiction is solely an individual moral failing.

> there are temptations to addiction all around us

Re: Alcohol-related deaths spiked during the pandemic, a study shows

#160

Post by kaczordon »

elliekelly wrote: post #136
sjg007 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Has he tried antabuse or something like that? Those pills make you vomit when you drink and are quite effective in harnessing the body's natural anti-poison response system to curb drinking.

For some reason we, as a society, have decided certain health problems are moral failures to be treated with shame and cured through willpower alone rather than modern medical intervention.

People often turn to drugs when there are other problems in their life they can’t deal with. Drug abuse is not just about the physical hook.
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