Elizabeth Holmes found guilty • Hacker News Board

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#151

Post by nmz » Tue, Jan 04, 2022, 1:03 AM UTC

celticninja wrote: post #64

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't know all of the details behind each count, but glad to see this result, which seems good and fair. Basically, looks like the majority of "committing fraud against investors" charges were guilty, but the "committing fraud against patients ", which always seemed like more of a stretch to me, were not guilty.

I wonder if that was because they used other testing methods to check patient samples, so they patient got a result regardless of the means by which it was obtained.

Still seems like fraud to me, they advertised a single drop of blood and they ended up taking blood samples the normal method.

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#152

Post by VWWHFSfQ » Tue, Jan 04, 2022, 1:03 AM UTC

compiler-guy wrote: post #131

VWWHFSfQ wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My understanding is that it worked in the sense that the results were accurate. But the results were gotten by means other than what the investors/customers thought. So the end-user patients really had no claim since they got correct results. But the companies and investors got scammed bigtime.

The vast majority of results were not only not accurate, couldn't possibly have been accurate given the methods they were using to conduct the tests. This is well documented. I suggest John Carreyrou's book, _Bad Blood_, which gets into great detail on this.

Once again, just because some dude wrote it down in a book doesn't mean it's a fact. The jury just acquitted her of those charges. Maybe they didn't the read dude's book?

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#153

Post by sho_hn » Tue, Jan 04, 2022, 1:04 AM UTC

wrs wrote: post #112

meetingthrower wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of my biggest regrets is not getting a Kozmo messenger bag from dotcom 1.

One of my prized possessions is a Kozmo-branded CD opener, which I got by ordering a single CD from Kozmo, with free one-hour delivery. Thanks, venture capital!

What intrigued me about your comment is the reference to a "CD opener". I had no idea!

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#154

Post by sharkweek » Tue, Jan 04, 2022, 1:04 AM UTC

filmgirlcw wrote: post #135

sharkweek wrote: post #25

This will sound weird but I am a collector of swag from large companies that have collapsed due to anything from mismanagement to outright fraud. While we're a rare breed there are others like me out there. Still, even with this oddly specific marketplace being small, let me tell you, the Theranos swag market is hot right now (check eBay if you're curious). Wish I had gone big on this one earlier, because I have a fe…

I am also a fucked company swag collector and Theranos has been my white whale since 2015/early 2016. Now it’s all knockoffs. I wish you luck in your search!

Well well… I imagine we’ve crossed paths on eBay before - too funny.

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#155

Post by duxup » Tue, Jan 04, 2022, 1:04 AM UTC

What always amazed me is they had nothing… nothing that could do the thing they claimed. To the point they used competitors machines to produce results.

Pretty amazing.

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#156

Post by filmgirlcw » Tue, Jan 04, 2022, 1:04 AM UTC

sharkweek wrote: post #41

daenz wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What a super interesting niche. Do you see returns on your investments?

To be completely honest, I'm more of a buyer than a seller. I have a few items that are "worth" (in a loose sense) in the hundreds and thousands, but most are nothing more than a rare conversation piece I have on my desk.

Did you get the MSCHF fucked company toys? The tiny Theranos machine is adorable.

Like you, I collect fucked/defunct company merch, tho my collection isn’t just fraud related, I’ve got Quibi merch — most of it is. I’ve got MoviePass, Fyre Festival legit merch with tags, Ozy Media was a recent one, Enron business cards, Arthur Andersen tote bags, Worldcom mugs, etc. I’ve even got some old Internet Explorer merch, because it’s kitsch!

What is your favorite piece?

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#157

Post by AdamN » Tue, Jan 04, 2022, 1:05 AM UTC

whatever1 wrote: post #149

sharkweek wrote: post #25

This will sound weird but I am a collector of swag from large companies that have collapsed due to anything from mismanagement to outright fraud. While we're a rare breed there are others like me out there. Still, even with this oddly specific marketplace being small, let me tell you, the Theranos swag market is hot right now (check eBay if you're curious). Wish I had gone big on this one earlier, because I have a fe…

Do you have the epic ENRON intern Tshirt in your collection ?

Why not a stock certificate :-)

https://www.apmex.com/product/50847/enron-corp-stock-certifi...

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#158

Post by brandall10 » Tue, Jan 04, 2022, 1:05 AM UTC

miohtama wrote: post #142

VWWHFSfQ wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is some of the scammiest markets of all time. Hey OP, I got a Theranos-branded mug I can drop-ship you from Alibaba. $800 OBO

What you do not have is called provenance :)

Just out of curiosity, how does one prove provenance?

I’d think the only way is to be the original owner (ie proof of employment at the company), but even then, given such a hot marketplace it would be super easy to just purchase and resell knockoffs.

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#159

Post by l33tman » Tue, Jan 04, 2022, 1:05 AM UTC

jonwachob91 wrote: post #40

It blows my mind that she was found guilty for defrauding investors, but not guilty for defrauding patients about their test results. Investors know that every dollar they put into a company could disappear, it's why startups get capital from investors and not bank loans. But a patient does not expect for their blood test results to be completely wrong. Her tests weren't giving false-negatives or false-positives, the…

My layman's interpretation is that she willingly defrauded investors but did in fact deliver test results to the patients, albeit at a lower quality level than you would expect in the industry.

I think in the HBO documentary they say the unravelling started because of FDA complaints on the bloodwork being sub par. But I think you can't jail someone for 120 years because they did a shoddy product. Maybe the prosecutors simply went for the biggest bang for their buck?

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#160

Post by abakker » Tue, Jan 04, 2022, 1:06 AM UTC

sharkweek wrote: post #25

This will sound weird but I am a collector of swag from large companies that have collapsed due to anything from mismanagement to outright fraud. While we're a rare breed there are others like me out there. Still, even with this oddly specific marketplace being small, let me tell you, the Theranos swag market is hot right now (check eBay if you're curious). Wish I had gone big on this one earlier, because I have a fe…

I've got two beer glasses from WeWork that say "glass half full" on them. They make me laugh every single time I see them.