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The pandemic has deepened an epidemic of loneliness

mcc.gse.harvard.edu

151–160 of 254 posts

Re: The pandemic has deepened an epidemic of loneliness

#151
you only get what you give. No matter how perfectly designed your city is or your status as homeowner/renter you're going to have to actually walk up to someone and say "hello".

I feel like a lot of people want companionship pushed to them in the same way an app pushes data.

Re: The pandemic has deepened an epidemic of loneliness

#152
post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The oldest gen z are just out of college though. I think it’s the younger millennials you might be describing (people a decade into their career with little prospect of home ownership).

As someone who graduated college into the Great Recession, I was told and shown no path to work for the better part of a decade after college-despite going back to college to become more marketable in that period. And seemingly nobody cares about people like me because we don’t get the ink that the people slightly older or younger than us get. On the other hand, I do wonder how the economic outlook for work in the US…

I’m the same age (although skipped college). Lots of friends in the same situation needing to get multiple degrees before finally finding their way into unrelated careers.

Re: The pandemic has deepened an epidemic of loneliness

#153
post #145

Loneliness isn't a problem. It's a necessary unpleasant state that promotes social activity akin to sleep pressure that forces you to sleep. The problem is that people are addicted to social simulacra (via social media) rather than actual social activity and so only accomplish temporary relief from the feeling of loneliness while retaining the state of loneliness (like binge drinking coffee instead of actually sleepi…

Is the article arguing that internet comms and social media is a substitute for face-to-face socializing? You seem to be arguing about a point that isn't being made.

Loneliness definitely is a problem if a pandemic makes socializing in person effectively impossible. We need people to be able to overcome their loneliness, temporarily not in person, so they don't risk spreading a lethal virus around.

Re: The pandemic has deepened an epidemic of loneliness

#154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If there’s a lull in conversation they pull out their phones. I despise how this behavior has been completely normalized. Especially in the dating sphere. People putting their phones on the table to make sure they never miss notifications is just so fucking disrespectful to the people you're actually with.

Personally I never understood it as disrespectful, because I assume they’ve got some personal shit they might not be able to be uncontactable for. What if someone they know is in the hospital or they’re in some other high priority issue? What if a close friend of theirs is in a tenuous health position? What if they’re checking on their children? And most certainly they’re not going to tell me and frankly I’m not enti…

there was a time before people were reachable 24/7 and at no point in that time did the world or people's lives collapse.

Re: The pandemic has deepened an epidemic of loneliness

#155
post #4

It's a bit paradoxical. I have a tech company and most staff want to come to the office 1 day a week. Getting them to come is very tough. Many of my staff and friends don't want to have kids, make no effort to find a partner and find all sorts of excuses. Netflix, the internet and these things are part of the problem, but I have no clue what the solution is. There is only one way to not be lonely - be with people who…

I've chatted with a couple of people who feel that their country (USA) is descending into chaos, and they don't feel like investing in a doomed future. I agree with the general feeling, but I'm trying to use it to motivate myself to have more fun. As to why people feel doomed: Republicans are putting the most faithful trump zealots in places to most influence the next elections. Remember that the Republicans believe…

>The utter insidious evil of the election theft lie from trump is going to destroy the USA by removing any trust in elections.

I have the unenviable position of being against trust in elections and also against Trump.

Re: The pandemic has deepened an epidemic of loneliness

#156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The oldest gen z are just out of college though. I think it’s the younger millennials you might be describing (people a decade into their career with little prospect of home ownership).

Back in the 60s, people were buying homes in their early 20s or even late teens because it was that affordable. Obviously that is a bit of a historical anomaly, but it's almost a necessary complement to the idea you're supposed to become an adult and mature and grow up after age 18.

Perhaps we ran in different social classes but in the 60's most believed that you had to save a good portion of one's life to afford a home and worked towards that end. Home ownership was not a given - it was considered an enormous investment that took much of one's life to prepare for.

However, the affordable rental market greatly mitigated that and allowed "delayed" home ownership until a suitable nest egg was constructed.

Re: The pandemic has deepened an epidemic of loneliness

#157
post #124
post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about the policy aspect of telling people to isolate at home, avoid friends and family and other social gatherings, etc. for nearly 2 years now? I'm not a fan of making everything a political issue, but since you went there - I see one group of politicians actively trying to cut us off from each other (well-intentioned or not) with venue closures, capacity limits, travel restrictions, event cancellation, recomme…

State lock downs in the US generally lasted on the order of months (some amount of time between March-May of 2020), not years. If you're under the impression that you're still under a stay at home order and you can't see your family, or if you think your local music venue isn't putting on concerts, I would urge you to verify if that's truly the case. I mean, you can watch a football game on Sunday and see this. Also,…

Everybody you see now is a potential infectious disease vector.

And when everybody is wearing a mask, faceless, it sorta takes the human out of human-interaction.

And those guys not wearing masks, they're all filthy trumper qanon goblins. So ramp up the fear for that.

An obedient citizen rolls his eyes in terror.

Re: The pandemic has deepened an epidemic of loneliness

#158
post #145

Loneliness isn't a problem. It's a necessary unpleasant state that promotes social activity akin to sleep pressure that forces you to sleep. The problem is that people are addicted to social simulacra (via social media) rather than actual social activity and so only accomplish temporary relief from the feeling of loneliness while retaining the state of loneliness (like binge drinking coffee instead of actually sleepi…

>Loneliness isn't a problem.

This is a weird bone to pick. It's similar to saying "obesity isn't a problem, overeating is."

Like, yeah, sure, you can frame it that way if you want. But what utility have you added? So that you can build up to the conclusion that lonely people ought to go socialize properly? That's pretty tautological advice there mate.

Re: The pandemic has deepened an epidemic of loneliness

#159
post #4

It's a bit paradoxical. I have a tech company and most staff want to come to the office 1 day a week. Getting them to come is very tough. Many of my staff and friends don't want to have kids, make no effort to find a partner and find all sorts of excuses. Netflix, the internet and these things are part of the problem, but I have no clue what the solution is. There is only one way to not be lonely - be with people who…

I've chatted with a couple of people who feel that their country (USA) is descending into chaos, and they don't feel like investing in a doomed future. I agree with the general feeling, but I'm trying to use it to motivate myself to have more fun. As to why people feel doomed: Republicans are putting the most faithful trump zealots in places to most influence the next elections. Remember that the Republicans believe…

If people actually think their country has a chance of upcoming civil war (or many other crises like ecological collapse), they should expand their in-person social network -- mutual aid is an important resiliency strategy.

Re: The pandemic has deepened an epidemic of loneliness

#160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah yes, nothing like being forced to live with strangers and parents to solve loneliness. Seriously? If you care to look, there is actually a lot of research pointing that the pandemic affected the poor's ability to voluntarily socialize compared to the wealthy. If you think about it, it's incredibly obvious. And yet these authors didn't mention the idea once. That's unconscionable, if unsurprising.

Roommates are not necessarily strangers. If you are arguing living with parents doesn't decrease loneliness over living alone... I'm going to argue that's a non intuitive argument. That doesn't mean you are wrong necessarily but it does mean I'm probably going to question it. As far as I can tell this hasn't really been studied, at least this paper from 2019 on loneliness says "There is virtually no literature that l…

I'll say this again - it's completely absurd to ignore the issue of class / wealth inequality when considering access to social situations that decrease loneliness.

And it's dumb beyond words to write a fucking Harvard paper on loneliness and not mention wealth inequality once.

I don't believe these statements need to be backed up by science to be self-evident, and worthy of research. That's a tautology, and a dumb one.

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