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How to Run a Ponzi Scheme for Tech People

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151–160 of 265 posts

Re: How to Run a Ponzi Scheme for Tech People

#151
While there are indeed lots of people doing this sort of thing, I notice people being accused of it who are in fact successful and are giving out actionable advice. (They're easy to spot if you look, because they don't ask you to buy their course).

Imagine, for example, that you had stumbled across a Magic Formula to create a niche Software as a Service business that brings in $5,000/month while only taking up 10 hours of your time each week. Why would you give that formula away when you could just use it yourself over and over and become a zillionaire?

Well, let's think about it. Assuming you do have that Magic Formula and have used it once, what are your options?

1. Go live on the beach in Thailand. Forever.

2. Build another business that brings in $5,000/month for 10hrs/week effort.

Notice that each spin of the Magic Formula cuts another 10 hours/week out of your schedule of growing your hair and hanging out with that blonde girl from the article. Spin it 4 times and you're back to having a full time job like the rest of the world.

So you don't do that. You hang out on the beach, wondering why more people don't do what you're doing. And you from time to time try to nudge a few more people into doing so themselves.

At least that's my take on it, having spun that formula twice.

Re: How to Run a Ponzi Scheme for Tech People

#152

Seen so much of this bullshit while travelling around SE Asia. I swear 90% of nomads are dropshipping/life coaches running ponzi schemes, and the other 10% are geeks like me who lucked into remote-friendly coding gigs. Sprinkled with some truly fascinating folks who genuinely discovered some new and interesting way of making this work for them.

Can confirm. I was a lucky geek nomad who worked remotely. I had a regular software developer job just like I would if I was "back home".

Re: How to Run a Ponzi Scheme for Tech People

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

/r/wallstreetbets exists for a different reason, but it got exacerbated by everything you mentioned above. WSB members have come to realize that so-called "financial professionals" by and large have no scrying crystal into the market. WSB got there because of the democratization of knowledge that the Internet has caused. And before you cite some unicorn like Renaissance, that's generating 40% YOY for 20+ years, keep…

This is based on a common misunderstanding of what “Wall Street” does. The Hollywood-inspired folk concept of Wall Street is that they trade stocks. That’s what everybody in those big buildings in Manhattan does all day. They yell buy/sell orders into red phones and drink Scotch. Except they don’t. Wall Street firms like Goldman Sachs make money by providing services such as mergers and acquisitions, IPOs, market mak…

There is a cottage industry of financial advisors who do work with people on their personal wealth management. Of course there is a big difference between an investment bank, trading firm, and a person who does wealth management (I'd google it for precise terms, but I'll get hounded by ads for it for weeks). I know because my parents have a "wealth management guy"/broker and some of my friends' parents growing up were also in that business. And there are also of course mutual funds and pensions as you mention.

I am not super plugged into the financial industry so I can't say for certain, but I think while people may not understand the difference between traders shouting on phones, "wall street", and wealth management, people think about wealth management the most in the context of "wall street", because that's what they're personally most familiar with. They think that even though wealth management seems to me to be very decentralized and not really something physically centered around Wall St.

I think wallstreetbets is mostly a pretty unsophisticated subreddit (which somehow declined in quality even more as it grew) but I think the parent was valid in pointing out that they willingly eschew the old-school strategy of diversification + "value investing" done by a third party on your behalf and the new-school (boglehead) strategy of putting literally everything in the S&P 500 or a bond index with the allocation mix dependent on retirement date/age.

There has undoubtedly always been a group of people micromanaging their personal portfolios with less risk-averse strategies like this, and WSB mostly takes things way too far, but at least for me it exposed me to the idea that maybe I could personally do better picking stocks on my own than just blindly throwing everything into VOO (and for people not plugged into the online-personal-finance-geek community, it could be the first time they even realize they don't need to have a third party manage their investments for them).

Re: How to Run a Ponzi Scheme for Tech People

#154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, no reference to crypto and blockchain? This article didn't cover the most worrying ponzi scheme I've seen since public pension plans.

blockchain is more like a Pump and Dump scam. You can run it just once. Ponzi schemes require several iterations of the scam to be successful.

You say that because you haven't heard of the latest crypto investment form. You put $140 at least 6 month in a new cryptocurrency deposit. In exchange, you get paid every tuesday during this time, you also get sent a red visa card and a premium Spotify account (you never have to pirate again!). Plus, if you're referred, you and your referrer will get $25 dollars free.

Now, when I asked where did that money come from, the guy on Twitch told me "it's like a bank, the money comes from you". The difference here is, of course, this gives you much, much higher returns than a bank while a bank can actually invest your money, and this "entity" cannot. Also the interface of some of these "investment" agencies look like a game, I guess to be more attractive [1].

In the end, the idea is always the same: crypto will only go up. So far that's been the case, though.

[1] https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EjI5hTcU0AAnUO0.png

Re: How to Run a Ponzi Scheme for Tech People

#155
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How about merely building a business? More people need to be told this. The combination of work ethic, of risk tolerance, and of perseverance against ridiculous odds that is required to build a Tesla, or an Apple, or a Whatever, is extraordinarily rare

I'd say the combo of "work ethic, risk tolerance, and perseverance against ridiculous odds" involved in Tesla/Apple/etc, is orders of magnitude more commonly found than actual Tesla/Apple/etc level success...

I'd say the combo of "work ethic, risk tolerance, and perseverance against ridiculous odds" involved in Tesla/Apple/etc, is orders of magnitude more commonly found than actual Tesla/Apple/etc level success...

Agreed. For every tech millionaire there are a thousand guys who are just as smart and worked just as hard and it didn’t work out for whatever reason. Maybe their timing was off by a mere 6 months for example. There’s a lot of survivorship bias in what is in large part a lottery.

Re: How to Run a Ponzi Scheme for Tech People

#156

Easier. Step 1. Invent Bitcoin.

Back then when bitcoin is still in its infancy, there is not much to do with bitcoin in your wallet apart from gifting each other some coins (bitcoin faucet was pretty generous back then). So people on bitcointalk forum often openly running some ponzi scheme and a lot of people would join just for the heck of it. There was nothing shady about it as the organizer would openly admit its a ponzi scheme (something along…

No idea why you're getting downvoted. It's completely true and I participated in a few. The excitement was that you knew it could blow up at any time so it was like gambling.

When you got your profits you often sent it back to the scheme. It was a classic chicken race where you wanted to pull out just before it crashed.

Re: How to Run a Ponzi Scheme for Tech People

#157
post #6

This article is fantastic. I think "get rich quick" schemes are so much worse when it comes to my generation and beyond (millennials/gen-z). People have been endlessly screwed over: graduated college during the 2008 economic bust, lived with parents until their 30s, fired/laid off during the 2020 pandemic -- so I fundamentally understand the mirage of Instagram fame and endless sacks of money for doing basically noth…

Don't try build the next big app? If you're frustrated by the status quo, reject it and live life by your own values. Also nothing (bar the pandemic) is stopping you going to Thailand or another cheap location and building your app from there. The flight tickets will pay themselves off in cost of living savings pretty quickly.

Re: How to Run a Ponzi Scheme for Tech People

#158

I think one of the biggest issues is that tech people are "know it alls". They make lots of money, they must be smart right? So when a friend disagrees the person doesn't consider it. And unlike their Engineering counterparts they won't search for proof. If you need to see real world examples, look at who buys brand name. It's telling.

I think we all remember which group of people green-lit Soylent.

Soylent is actually not a bad idea IMO, and it kind of spawned a small industry of competitors (e.g. Huel), the problem there is that entrepreneurs have a tendency to make products that only appeal to other people in their techy/"product"/entrepreneurial bubble isolated to a small number of US cities. And I say that as someone who really likes Coffiest (or whatever they call it know)

Re: How to Run a Ponzi Scheme for Tech People

#159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Grew up rich? I don't think that's accurate. I know a lot of Musk-hating articles have been played up, particularly on socialist Twitter circles, alleging that Musk inherited family wealth from an emerald mine. But this is simply not true. The emerald mine story is dubious and vague, and it's only real mention is from Ashlee Vance's book on Musk, and her source is Elon's father. Elon and his mother fled an allegedly…

Elon later got thousands of dollars from his dad to start Zip2 so it's not like he ran away without a safety net. He did what so many other trust fund babies have done: He slummed. Stop contributing to the Horatio Algers narrative that Musk spins, among hundreds of other yarns,

Per https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zip2

> In Ashlee Vance's biography of Elon Musk, it is claimed that the Musks' father, Errol Musk, provided them with US$28,000 during this time,[4]:Ch.4 but Elon Musk later denied this.[6] He later clarified that his dad provided around 10% of US$200,000 as part of a later funding round.[7]

I feel like someone who is able to get 90% of their funding round could either convince an existing investor in the round or convince someone else to join the round. This doesn't sound like money to "start Zip2" as you claim.

Also, note that Elon had to shower at a YMCA while starting up Zip2 (https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/19/how-elon-musk-founded-zip2-w...). Does that really sound like a "trust fund baby" to you? I feel like a lot of the myths trying to tear down Elon Musk's successes are all sourced from Ashlee Vance's book, which in turn are based on, as I understand it, interviews of Errol Musk himself (the father).

Re: How to Run a Ponzi Scheme for Tech People

#160
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot two factors: capital (which excludes the vast majority of people om earth), and an enormous amount of luck.

It's pretty easy for a technology business to get capital these days.

I don't want that capital though. All it's doing is ossifying the power structures that are the cause of the major problems we are facing. It's a trap.
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