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Eclipse Theia 1.0 – Open-Source Alternative to Visual Studio Code

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Re: Eclipse Theia 1.0 – Open-Source Alternative to Visual Studio Code

#151

Post by oaiey »

lobo42 wrote: post #136
oaiey wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So we talk the Installer, the brand/icon (which is good that it is strictly owned by one entity) and literally settings. These do not make the product less open source (I do not dare to use the term free). Linux is free software, however RedHat is not. You can do everything with the OSS version you can with the VS Code. However, there are extensions delivered in the Brand VS Code (Remote Server SSH/Docker/WSL) which…

For adopters, i.e. organizations that want to invent something new on top of existing open-source code, there is a huge difference between the VS Code-kind of open-source where the project is still fully controlled by a single vendor and vendor neutral open-source. E.g. Kubernetes wouldn't be where it is if Google hadn't put it into a vendor neutral open-source foundation. You can tell from the many adopters of Theia…

I agree to that. That is a different intent than what vs code project has. And that is the fair right of a project/community.

PS: I think it is a pity that they prevent this. The branding and leadership alone will make VS Code the dominant player completely independent of what derived product ever be. The lack of open sourced vscode-server makes me really unhappy.

Re: Eclipse Theia 1.0 – Open-Source Alternative to Visual Studio Code

#152

Post by oaiey »

correct_horse wrote: post #149
oaiey wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So we talk the Installer, the brand/icon (which is good that it is strictly owned by one entity) and literally settings. These do not make the product less open source (I do not dare to use the term free). Linux is free software, however RedHat is not. You can do everything with the OSS version you can with the VS Code. However, there are extensions delivered in the Brand VS Code (Remote Server SSH/Docker/WSL) which…

The closed-source nature of VSCode is a little more practically important than you make it out to be. It prevents Linux distros from including VSCode in their package managers (except non-free categories, usually disabled by default). And makes it impossible to patch VSCode, only "Code - OSS". Also, for normal users, the brand/icon is everything. If they go to their computer and "the chrome icon is blue", they will w…

Agree to the annoying practical situations for the distributions. Unfortunately, a structural Linux problem. Is not that the old Firefox problem. They need to protect brand and reputation and cannot trust downstream packages.

Disagree with chrome comparison. Chrome adds tons of feature packages which are blobs or heavily proprietary stuff. VS Code does nothing of that. They add config settings and icons.

In regards of the open source built: Microsoft does that with .NET and it seems a pain. I mean, what is an open source build? A package different for 20 distributions with each 5 versions. Or a build script (which I hope they have :))

Re: Eclipse Theia 1.0 – Open-Source Alternative to Visual Studio Code

#153

Post by manigandham »

reaperducer wrote: post #86
flyinglizard wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I became involved in more and more products and customer feedback, I started opting into telemetry collection programs. It’s ultimately what helps make the products I use better.

In my opinion, you're doing it either wrong or lazy. My company doesn't do telemetry. We do actual user testing with actual users, even to the point of shadowing them as they use the product. The same way it's been done for the last 40 years. You learn more from interfacing with the wetware than you do grepping logs.

People act differently when they're being watched. Capturing the normal usage as they work with your product without any oversight can reveal a lot.

Re: Eclipse Theia 1.0 – Open-Source Alternative to Visual Studio Code

#154

Post by correct_horse »

oaiey wrote: post #152
correct_horse wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The closed-source nature of VSCode is a little more practically important than you make it out to be. It prevents Linux distros from including VSCode in their package managers (except non-free categories, usually disabled by default). And makes it impossible to patch VSCode, only "Code - OSS". Also, for normal users, the brand/icon is everything. If they go to their computer and "the chrome icon is blue", they will w…

Agree to the annoying practical situations for the distributions. Unfortunately, a structural Linux problem. Is not that the old Firefox problem. They need to protect brand and reputation and cannot trust downstream packages. Disagree with chrome comparison. Chrome adds tons of feature packages which are blobs or heavily proprietary stuff. VS Code does nothing of that. They add config settings and icons. In regards o…

I'm not familiar with the history or the closed-source feature set of chrome. This [1] search result shows rather minor features compared to a browser - codecs, flash player, auto-update (I suppose this is a big deal on non-linux). VSCode, on the other hand has a proprietary Visual Studio Marketplace extension, (extra?) telemetry and an updater. [2] (I found a better link)

I actually only want an open source build for macOS and Windows - on Linux I almost exclusively use what is in the package manager. I just wish "Code - OSS" had a more recognizable name (and icon), like "VS Code OSS edition" (with a different color of the same logo) Code OSS is just impossible to search.

[1] https://www.howtogeek.com/202825/what%E2%80%99s-the-differen... [2] https://github.com/microsoft/vscode/wiki/Differences-between...

Re: Eclipse Theia 1.0 – Open-Source Alternative to Visual Studio Code

#155

Post by oaiey »

correct_horse wrote: post #154
oaiey wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree to the annoying practical situations for the distributions. Unfortunately, a structural Linux problem. Is not that the old Firefox problem. They need to protect brand and reputation and cannot trust downstream packages. Disagree with chrome comparison. Chrome adds tons of feature packages which are blobs or heavily proprietary stuff. VS Code does nothing of that. They add config settings and icons. In regards o…

I'm not familiar with the history or the closed-source feature set of chrome. This [1] search result shows rather minor features compared to a browser - codecs, flash player, auto-update (I suppose this is a big deal on non-linux). VSCode, on the other hand has a proprietary Visual Studio Marketplace extension, (extra?) telemetry and an updater. [2] (I found a better link) I actually only want an open source build fo…

Ok, I stand corrected. The comparison with Chrome is roughly fair. My memory was mislead by this article https://www.ghacks.net/2019/04/09/microsoft-edge-google-feat... . And I still cannot belief this is all open source :)

Re: Eclipse Theia 1.0 – Open-Source Alternative to Visual Studio Code

#156

Post by ASalazarMX »

sbuttgereit wrote: post #75
ysleepy wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hm. I remember it having utterly horrible UX and looks, but being slow wasn't really a problem. Especially the live compilation and whole project compilation error marking is something IntelliJ has not yet accomplished.

Yeah... but what the original post is about isn't the old Eclipse IDE we've all known and loved (to hate, maybe). But a new entry in the Electron based text editor craze... to me just glancing over the website, it looks like a VS Code clone. That the Eclipse IDE itself is more an analogue to Visual Studio proper could be where some on the Eclipse marketing team are mixing up the two and mentioning "VS Code fees".

You're right, it's a Javascript (Typescript) IDE, not the good old Eclipse; they're on equal footing.

Re: Eclipse Theia 1.0 – Open-Source Alternative to Visual Studio Code

#157

Post by srndh »

I was hoping Eclipse/Firefox would partner with Sublime Text/NotePad++. There is enough people on electron-based text editor with Atom & VSCode variant. I was hoping a different product needs to grow.

Yes, I know ST is closed-source. But as a user, I feel that its starting to hurt ST. I personally feel (not a pro-developer), ST is better than VSCode. ST is a better match for Firefox. I am hoping that the ST developer joins Mozilla.

Notepad++ has a eclipse-lite vibe. I was hoping eclipse could help Notepad++ reach linux & mac. But please dont put it in JVM, that is the original sin of Eclipse.

We need more alternatives.

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