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US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

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Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#151

Post by acdha »

blackflame7000 wrote: post #75
mhandley wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yesterday I was driving back from Scotland to England, doing 70ish, when we ran into a really heavy thunderstorm. Went from good visibility to almost zero in seconds, and the only thing I could properly see was the crash barrier alongside the lane. I found myself desperately trying to see where the road was, simultaneously trying not to get rear-ended as I slowed up, switch on the rear fog lamps and hazards, max wipe…

You know, when you take your drivers test in the US, you have to demonstrate your ability to know where all those functions are before you even pull away to start your test.

This is like the arguments that C programmers just need to be more careful about errors. We know that people make mistakes, get distracted, and get older. Real engineering is about designing systems which work well in actual conditions, not some unrealistic ideal case assuming perfect conditions.

It’s also simply wrong: in California, I had to show use of turn signals – not anything else – and no other place I’ve driven since has ever made me pass a test again. Assuming that everyone reads the manual and practices with every new vehicle is unrealistic, so you’re looking at potentially half-century lags between what’s tested and what people are driving.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#152

Post by jacobr »

mhandley wrote: post #18
jakear wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why I detest touchscreens for most car functions. Specifically AC, with old fashioned knobs I have full control over AC without taking my eyes off the road, but nowadays everyone wants to put it on their infotainment system, hidden beneath 4 other buttons.

Yesterday I was driving back from Scotland to England, doing 70ish, when we ran into a really heavy thunderstorm. Went from good visibility to almost zero in seconds, and the only thing I could properly see was the crash barrier alongside the lane. I found myself desperately trying to see where the road was, simultaneously trying not to get rear-ended as I slowed up, switch on the rear fog lamps and hazards, max wipe…

My Volvo has touch controls for AC but physical buttons for quickly toggling windshield fans/demist. Feels like a decent compromise.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#153

Post by greedo »

dmix wrote: post #59
greedo wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most highly skilled FPS players are using mice/keyboard. In games where both console and PC are supported, PC players usually have far higher mechanical skills due to the greater controllability enabled by mouse/keyboard. Watch the OWL, and half the maneuvers that players make are simply impossible to do with a game controller.

What's your point? Anyone who's played video games is well aware that value of both in different contexts. Which is my point about it not being a panacea... It's not about the value of mice/keyboards vs controllers in gaming but about designing the best interfaces for the use-case. I doubt when the Navy designs their systems that they're trying to mimic professional gamers who needs 99.9% aiming accuracy and extremel…

My point was rebutting the nonsense you wrote about most FPS players using controllers.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#155

Post by jswizzy »

meddlepal wrote: post #60

> and that many were fatigued, with an average of 4.9 hours of sleep between the 14 crew members present. I suspect this played more of a role than any of the controls or procedures did. I had a friend in the Navy and he once explained the shifts he did to me and how utterly insane they were. I suspect leadership doesn't want to (or cant) fix the root cause (fatigue) and is happy to spend tax dollars to replace the s…

Can confirm. I was a nuke in the Navy and four hours was probably the most amount of sleep I ever got underway. You work 12-14 days underway and stand 8 and 8 watches then have to wait an hour in line to get chow and then they run drills that the whole ship has to participate in. If you can do get any sleep it's because you hide in the bilge and sleep on pipe or in a ac room.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#156

Post by toast0 »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #145
IgorPartola wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could do one of two things. First, a heated windshield like I believe some Landrovers have. It’s about $5000 to replace, last I heard, but it works. Second, a double pane windshield like house windows or some motorcycle helmet face shields. These work 100% of the time, but would definitely be more expensive as well.

Best car I had for window defrosting/demisting was a Ford Mondeo which had a fine-mesh heating element embedded. Super fast clearing. More expensive than regular glass but not $5000 by a long shot.

I had a Honda Accord with a cracked radiator.... It defrosted right quick, but idling it after it warmed up was very ungood. After the radiator was replaced defrost went back to normal.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#157

Post by CamperBob2 »

Someone1234 wrote: post #48
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question: Why don't modern cars yet monitor humidity in and outside the car and make the correct decisions to keep your windows clear? Why are we focusing on self-driving cars while our cars are too dumb to do this much on their own?

It isn't caused by any specific humidity levels. While it is depositing water droplets on to the glass surface, that same water is normally suspended harmlessly in the air (it is effectively de-humidifying the air onto the cold windows). It is caused by the glass's surface temperature being much lower than the air temperature inside the car. Humans are warm. The air we breath is warm. We're heating up the interior of…

But figuring out the glass's temp is non-trivial.

Not really. Many windshields already have elements embedded in them like the ultra-thin wire used for the AM radio antenna. Sensing temperature via the resistance of a wire like that is about as trivial as it gets.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#158

Post by wbl »

acdha wrote: post #151
blackflame7000 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know, when you take your drivers test in the US, you have to demonstrate your ability to know where all those functions are before you even pull away to start your test.

This is like the arguments that C programmers just need to be more careful about errors. We know that people make mistakes, get distracted, and get older. Real engineering is about designing systems which work well in actual conditions, not some unrealistic ideal case assuming perfect conditions. It’s also simply wrong: in California, I had to show use of turn signals – not anything else – and no other place I’ve dri…

I always wondered if Californians know what turn signals are.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#159

Post by CamperBob2 »

mattmcknight wrote: post #121
mlonkibjuyhv wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think knowing the temperatures and such amounts to predicting the foggy state. Detecting it could look much different. Visual observation is obvious. With purpose built glass, perhaps one could look at electrical properties on the inside of the windshield. Maybe changes in the reflectivity of the glass could be used. Maybe some refractive index shenanigans?

This seems like a simpler route. Why not just a camera pointed at a test mark on the windshield that checks if it is visible through the glass?

Or simply look for reflectivity at an angle, like the recent HN story about the guy who implemented a touchscreen on his Macbook by adding a small mirror to the camera above the screen.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#160

Post by jschwartzi »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #43
liability wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because when the sensor goes screwy I don't want my car to start flipping shit like the defroster on when it's not needed? Because manual controls make such automation totally unnecessary? Because even if the automated system were designed to be "fail safe", the state that's 'safe' is actually context dependent, therefore manual controls will be necessary anyway? It ain't broke, so stop trying to 'fix' it.

The problem is the current solution doesn't work. Because trying to perfect those settings manually while driving in near zero visibility is scary and dangerous. And nobody even knows the correct settings to use! There are YouTube videos testing whether cold or warm air is the fastest way to defrost and/or defog your window, because nobody knows or remembers. I honestly don't remember and my solution is "try both for…

I just leave the defrost on when it's raining or cold regardless of whether my windshield is fogging. No need for an automated system and my windshield never fogs up.
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