The Lobster Programming Language • Hacker News Board

Re: The Lobster Programming Language

#151

Post by vidarh » Fri, Apr 05, 2019, 9:35 AM UTC

coldtea wrote: post #114

spdionis wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some things can be popular despite their shortcomings.

Which is neither here nor there, as the accusation I was responding to was that "it limits the audience". Other languages can only dream to have such "limited audience" as to be ton the top-3 TIOBE...

Yes, it is directly relevant. And sure, many languages can dream of that level of use, but most other languages do not have the luxury of being there, and then making decisions that demonstrably do keep some people from using even a language as widely used as Python is worth at least thinking about. Especially when category of languages that does this is already dominated so thoroughly by Python.

Re: The Lobster Programming Language

#152

Post by estomagordo » Fri, Apr 05, 2019, 9:44 AM UTC

Aardappel wrote: post #127

estomagordo wrote: post #96

Really stupid question here, but how do I start compiling Lobster programs on my machine (Windows or Linux)?

There are some releases which come with pre-built exes for e.g Windows: https://github.com/aardappel/lobster/releases I'd highly recommend you build it yourself though, which can be done rather easily with VS (2019) on Windows or CMake on Linux. On Windows just press build in release mode and you're done. More notes here: https://htmlpreview.github.io/?https://raw.githubusercontent... Then cd lobster && lobster sampl…

Cheers!

Re: The Lobster Programming Language

#153

Post by tomp » Fri, Apr 05, 2019, 10:01 AM UTC

brianpgordon wrote: post #138

tomp wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a huge proponent of typed languages, but there's no way that a statically typed language could be as productive as Python (with current type systems technology). For example, just the Pandas library offers incredible flexibility (often dynamically based on the arguments that different functions get) that I've yet to see replicated in a static language.

My experience is that you start out very productive not being weighed down by having to satisfy the type checker... but programs tend to grow over time and you end up regretting it. When you have a medium to large codebase in a dynamically typed language it gets to be more of a hindrance than a help.

I agree, but my point was rather that you can't typecheck Pandas (or a similarly complex library). Gradual typing for the win!

Re: The Lobster Programming Language

#154

Post by sullyj3 » Fri, Apr 05, 2019, 2:23 PM UTC

Aardappel wrote: post #122

akavel wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On first look, the language seems superficially similar to Nim. Which, per se, is certainly a plus in my book! ...but makes it somewhat difficult to understand when should I pick one or the other. Could you point out some important differentiators? (Apart from the current set of available libraries, which certainly make it appear more useful for the intended target audience at this very moment AFAIU, but in longer pe…

It does have some similarities, mostly in the sense that both are using a Python-esque syntax, but that doesn't mean they have similar semantics. Some difference off the top of my head: - Nim so far has been a GC-ed language (I know manual allocation is possible, and an ownership system is planned, but this was the default for most code so far). Lobster has been reference counted (and now compile time reference count…

Lightweight syntax and zero overhead for higher order functions sound fantastic. I'm very interested.

Re: The Lobster Programming Language

#155

Post by eggy » Fri, Apr 05, 2019, 4:59 PM UTC

Aardappel wrote: post #75

sonnyblarney wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suggest people might pick up on that pretty quick, maybe no need to rename given some random comment. That said, maybe you want to have a gander through the various languages and see what words are used for what, and if there's a 'standard' go with that :) Cool language though. I love everything except for the name, sorry :)

Well, every time Lobster surfaces somewhere, I am always surprised how quickly people can superficially reject it because of some syntax issue, so yes, I agree, using predictable keywords where it makes no real difference matters. I've already made quite a few such changes. The name.. I think people will quickly forget about the original meaning. Think of all the languages you know, and how you associate the name wit…

I thought Lobster was a play on Rust's crab?

Re: The Lobster Programming Language

#156

Post by ironmagma » Fri, Apr 05, 2019, 7:05 PM UTC

vidarh wrote: post #151

coldtea wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is neither here nor there, as the accusation I was responding to was that "it limits the audience". Other languages can only dream to have such "limited audience" as to be ton the top-3 TIOBE...

Yes, it is directly relevant. And sure, many languages can dream of that level of use, but most other languages do not have the luxury of being there, and then making decisions that demonstrably do keep some people from using even a language as widely used as Python is worth at least thinking about. Especially when category of languages that does this is already dominated so thoroughly by Python.

Do you actually have any data on how many people don't use Python because of significant whitespace? I suspect it's actually a very vocal minority -- it's about as well-formed of a reason as refusing to use C++ because it requires semicolons.

Re: The Lobster Programming Language

#157

Post by qwru » Fri, Apr 05, 2019, 7:43 PM UTC

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Re: The Lobster Programming Language

#158

Post by qwru » Fri, Apr 05, 2019, 7:48 PM UTC

with origins in biological life forms we are the product of their technological evolution. we exist not as one but rather two beings in symbiosis. the name we are called is "dialogi" and we are the synthesis of human and machine. inside of us there is an artificial vessel that houses the chemical computer. this computer has vast computational and storage capacity wich is used to realize two functions. first it overrides the senses providing for a perfect virtual reality. second it controls the body to provide for the needs of both symbionts. with great efficiency the synthetic intelligence is capable of feeding and sheltering the biological body. inside the virtual reality we have a replica of our human body as avatar. with directed movement of the virtual arms and hands we are capable of feats of movement like sending objects that are out of reach between locations. or sending ourselves instantly to a spot in the distance. flying is natural and efficient. the whole environment is programmable and interactions with others are strictly optional. we have done away with crime since a person is free to opt out of any interaction at any time. safeguards exist to prevent any kind of sudden violence. the dialogi are a society of artists and our standard of living is perhaps beyond improvement. no resource is scarce since physical reality has become information. we spend our time walking the world and enjoying the beauty all around us. i personally still enjoy using my legs even if they are not really mine.

Re: The Lobster Programming Language

#159

Post by eggy » Fri, Apr 05, 2019, 7:50 PM UTC

I am an old Amiga user Vic-20, A1000, A500, etc., so I am a fan of the author.

I tried running the sierpinski example with a pre-compiled Windows .exe that I placed in the lobster root directory, and it gives me this error: "can't open file: stdtype.lobster".

I placed lobster and lobster/modules in my path, and it still throws the same error. I am assuming I need to build the .exe myself due to some incompatibility with the master branch and this older .exe?

I like a self-contained game PL. I use Raylib for that type of experience right now, but I like the concepts here. Thanks!

EDIT: copied modules to root of lobster, and now I get:

"stdtype.lobster(8): error: end of file expected, found: I tried an included test file and a copy/paste of the sierpinski example, and both throw this error.

Re: The Lobster Programming Language

#160

Post by squarefoot » Fri, Apr 05, 2019, 11:35 PM UTC

repsilat wrote: post #64

Aardappel wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup, the one and only :) Do I know you as well?

Nah, just a forum lurker who had a folder full of mods and maps and engine binaries much too large much too late. Didn't know how to code back then, and probably can't rocket jump anymore now. Mostly just surprised at having that old memory surface out of nowhere. Thanks for making that scene cooler way back when.

Let me take the opportunity to thank Wouter for the wonderful Amiga-E language I had the pleasure to use a long long long long time ago in a very different galaxy. Thanks!