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Ask HN: How to speak like a leader, not like an engineer?

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Re: Ask HN: How to speak like a leader, not like an engineer?

#151

Post by harryf »

Two books well worth reading in this context are;

- Getting More by Stuart Diamond - https://www.amazon.com/Getting-More-Negotiate-Succeed-Work/d... . On the cover it’s about negotiation but most of what a leader does involves negotiation. Rather than try to convince you, I’ll just say Google engages Stuart Diamond to trail engineers in negotiation. There’s a talk by him here at Google that might convince - https://youtu.be/2QtZ-vObJrk

- The other is “Corps Business” - https://www.amazon.com/Corps-Business-Management-Principles-... - about how the US Marines do management. The big thing you can get some this book is expressing projects and tasks in terms of the _end goal_ instead of the steps required to get there. Make sure teams collectively understand the end goal and let them figure out how to get there is the basic message. That implies you need to put your effort in being good at story telling and presentation

Re: Ask HN: How to speak like a leader, not like an engineer?

#152

Post by Sharlin »

sethhochberg wrote: post #11
byoung2 wrote: post #4

An engineer focuses on the what, where, and how...a leader focuses on the who and why. For example you are considering adding a feature to your app. As an engineer you think of what you need to build how to implement it, where to store the data or put the logic. A manager focuses on why you should or shouldn't build it, who on the team does what part, how much it costs, etc. Imagine the transition from line cook to e…

One of my favorite ways to sum this up is thinking tactically (who and why) vs operationally (what and how). The third layer on top of all of this is strategic thinking (in theory, what your executive team is providing... even higher level and longer term abstract goals). Your executive team thinks strategically about what the goal is, your engineering management thinks tactically about the people and tasks needed to…

I think you’re mixing up tactical and operational though. In the standard military vocabulary at least, the operational level of decisionmaking (what) is between strategic (why; the most abstract) and tactical (how; the most concrete).

Re: Ask HN: How to speak like a leader, not like an engineer?

#153

Post by timwis »

Is he referring to the way that you talk to your team, or the way that you talk to him? If the latter, there's a chance he's insecure about his lack of technical knowledge and reassures himself that his role is to be the "leader" so he doesn't need it. And so when he hears you getting outside his comfort zone he projects that value onto you.

If he means to your team, or it has nothing to do with technical language, then I'm way off!

Re: Ask HN: How to speak like a leader, not like an engineer?

#154

Post by tyingq »

"Talk like a leader" could be code for:

- more (realistic) optimism

- accountability / ownership

- more listening, asking questions, versus making statements

- stating things in business terms versus technical ones. For example, if there's a technical problem, speak to options, costs and timelines instead of the detailed reasons why something isn't working.

- paying attention to business goals. For example, if there's a focus on lowering expense (as opposed to capital), show the finance team that they may be able to capitalize reserved instances in AWS.

- weigh business goals versus technical goals. Does rewriting that tech debt benefit the company now, or is there a temporary situation where deferring it for 6 months is better? (say, using that time for a long wanted feature instead)

Re: Ask HN: How to speak like a leader, not like an engineer?

#155

Post by arcanus »

8bithero wrote: post #128

As a fellow engineer facing the same problem, I don't believe it's so much in the language, but more the outlook and how you perceive things. As an engineer, we tend to get into a lot of nitty gritty, with a lot of "it might be possible if we first do X, Y and Z, but that assumes A and B don't take place, in which case we need to do..." I guess the "correct" answer here would be "Yes it should be possible, but give m…

I'll second 'extreme ownership'

It is particularly pertinent to working across groups, organizations or even separate businesses.

Re: Ask HN: How to speak like a leader, not like an engineer?

#156

Post by Delmania »

mattkrause wrote: post #149
Delmania wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In short when communicating with anyone outside of engineering, figure out what they care about and speak to that.

That is great advice for anyone, anywhere!

Thanks! This is the condensed version of what the OP's manager is asking him to do. As mentioned elsewhere, also keep in mind you can't change peoples' minds or make a decision for them, you have to present the your case so that your audience comes to the conclusion you want them to.

Re: Ask HN: How to speak like a leader, not like an engineer?

#157

Post by cube00 »

nlawalker wrote: post #64

A piece of simple, concrete, implementable advice I read recently that I really like is "communicate in the language of options , not demands, imperatives, requests, or preferences." Imagine yourself having a conversation with your manager or someone in a relatively similar position about a decision or suggestion you have. How often do you say things like "we have to", "we need to", "we really should", "can we", or "…

The nice thing about presenting options along with their pros and cons is the option accepted by management also has its attached cons explicitly accepted too (often in writing)

Re: Ask HN: How to speak like a leader, not like an engineer?

#158

Post by heisenbit »

Your impact depends on the authenticity and emotions you put behind it. Faking any particular style is bound to get you into trouble in the long run. That does not mean specific techniques are not worth trying out and seeing whether they fit you.

As a leader you are making decisions and stand behind them - not all of them are purely based on the subject matter but take the wider context in. As an engineer you are evaluating options. These are distinctive roles and lower level managers have to do both. Be clear with yourself and others when you are doing what.

Re: Ask HN: How to speak like a leader, not like an engineer?

#159

Post by FigmentEngine »

There are three roles in play here: * individual contributor (engineer). someone has skills to do something. works out how to achieve something. * manager. someone who ensures teams are happy, succeed and progress. manages resources (money and time), allocating to deliver results. * leader. someone who others can follow, paints a vision of where we want to get to, and why.

most people ask others to be leaders, when they mean managers.

you can be a IC and a Leader at the same time, or a manager and a Leader at the same time, but IC and Manager is often disaster (too busy focus on solving an issue to look up and see other issues).

Re: Ask HN: How to speak like a leader, not like an engineer?

#160

Post by rsp1984 »

nlawalker wrote: post #64

A piece of simple, concrete, implementable advice I read recently that I really like is "communicate in the language of options , not demands, imperatives, requests, or preferences." Imagine yourself having a conversation with your manager or someone in a relatively similar position about a decision or suggestion you have. How often do you say things like "we have to", "we need to", "we really should", "can we", or "…

Given the support for this answer I will likely get downvoted for this, but I disagree with this advice.

I am a co-founder (and CTO) of a small company myself and hence get to talk to the folks in my company quite regularly. I disagree with the notion that passion or personal preference doesn't belong in a decision-making process. Not only does it belong there, it is even a critical part of it, assuming of course that you have good arguments to make for your point and convey it in a respectful and professional manner.

Having passion and personal preference displays that you are engaged in your job and identify with the work that you do and aren't afraid to speak your mind, which requires a certain level of trust. Even more, you were hired precisely because the company came to the conclusion that it can benefit from your (uncensored) input.

It sure depends on the context but presenting your thoughts as "one option is to...", is a marker that you are indifferent to the outcome. It generally does not display trust, confidence or engagement.

So, if your manager is worth her/his money he/she can handle strong opinions just fine and will also consider other viewpoints than yours in the decision making process.

W.r.t. "talk like a leader, not like an engineer", king_panic has the best answer IMO.

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