People make money off advance information all the time. Often you can see that in the price action -- take this for example: https://imgur.com/mJq1OcY Three days before a positive press release, demand pressure beings to drive up the price. Coincidence? I'm too jaded to believe that.
It's been pretty well established that insider trading is and has been rampant: https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/14/insider-trading-is-still-ram...
DOJ: Hackers broke into an SEC database and made millions from inside info
151–160 of 198 posts
Re: DOJ: Hackers broke into an SEC database and made millions from inside info
#152Earlier quoted context omitted.
>This is mostly to ensure people keep trading. In a world were inside-info is commonplace, trading without it is just stupid. I find this line of reasoning hard to swallow. As an individual I have significantly less info than hedge funds and other professionals but that doesn't change the fact that I want to buy Apple or whatever because I think it will grow over the next 5 years. Now if you add in the scenario where…
Tim Cook (and all other Apple employees) are legally disallowed from buying or selling Apple stock outside of specific, well-defined trading windows. In particular, they cannot legally benefit from unpublished earnings information.
I don't think this is true, at least for most employees. I think this only applies at higher levels, though of course insider trading laws are still in force.
Re: DOJ: Hackers broke into an SEC database and made millions from inside info
#153People make money off advance information all the time. Often you can see that in the price action -- take this for example: https://imgur.com/mJq1OcY Three days before a positive press release, demand pressure beings to drive up the price. Coincidence? I'm too jaded to believe that.
insider trading has to be the easiest damn thing in the world. discreetly tell someone you know in person a piece of insider knowledge, and let them profit off it, then reimburse you some how. i find it insane people think this isn't happening virtually 100% of the time.
Re: DOJ: Hackers broke into an SEC database and made millions from inside info
#154Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Overheard conversations between strangers, for example, are fair game. Wrong. It's insider trading if you have material, nonpublic information. It doesn't matter how you got that information.
Matt Levine has written extensively on how squishy the line can be: https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2015-07-31/when-c...
That's messed up. It should be a breach of fiduciary duty to continue to interface as investor relations with an investor who you have established a friendship with. Being friendly on the phone is one thing, but join family vacations? As the relationship becomes closer, the fishier any exclusive information provided should smell.
You become friends with someone? At a certain point both the investor and and investore relations personel should have to hand off the professional relationship to colleages to avoid the risk of insider trading charges.
Re: DOJ: Hackers broke into an SEC database and made millions from inside info
#155Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Overheard conversations between strangers, for example, are fair game. Wrong. It's insider trading if you have material, nonpublic information. It doesn't matter how you got that information.
No, it only matters if you had a duty to keep that information confidential: https://www.kiplinger.com/article/investing/T052-C008-S001-w...
Your article justifies it "Yes" answer because you were told the information was confidential, but then the "case study" used to back this up includes envelopes on cash being exchanged for this information. My reading of the other article seems to indicate that you would be fine because the CEO was not compensated by you for providing the information and there is nothing to indicate that this information was given as a gift.
Other article:
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2015-07-31/when-c...
Edit: Given the bloomberg article cites relevant supreme court cases, I'm more inclined to believe it.
Re: DOJ: Hackers broke into an SEC database and made millions from inside info
#156Earlier quoted context omitted.
...which happens anyway. Starting 5-10 minutes before the official earnings reports come out, investor.google.com gets hammered by bots, requesting every few milliseconds until the actual page is released. I knew an SRE that wanted to put up a fake earnings report until the official time at which the real one was released, to disincentivize this behavior, but the lawyers nixed that idea really quick.
Why didn't they just decide to delay the posting by 30 seconds? It's not like that would deter regular users but it completely eliminates the high speed trading case.
Re: DOJ: Hackers broke into an SEC database and made millions from inside info
#157People make money off advance information all the time. Often you can see that in the price action -- take this for example: https://imgur.com/mJq1OcY Three days before a positive press release, demand pressure beings to drive up the price. Coincidence? I'm too jaded to believe that.
It's been pretty well established that insider trading is and has been rampant: https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/14/insider-trading-is-still-ram...
Insider trading laws remove information from the system. A common argument is that Enron could have never Enroned without the help of insider trading laws.
The big winner here is Wallstreet because the information asymmetry still exists, and they now have the most knowledge that can legally be acted upon. (plus they can act on illegal knowledge and it's much harder to prove than anyone else acting on it).
Re: DOJ: Hackers broke into an SEC database and made millions from inside info
#158Related reading: today's Matt Levine piece on how hard it is to make money even with this info. https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-01-16/even-c...
They make successful trades 77% of the time they had insider information and 45% when they didnt. That clearly is an advantage. I would never expect a 90% success rate because of how random Wall Street is, but 77% over a period of time definitely is an advantage.
Re: DOJ: Hackers broke into an SEC database and made millions from inside info
#159People make money off advance information all the time. Often you can see that in the price action -- take this for example: https://imgur.com/mJq1OcY Three days before a positive press release, demand pressure beings to drive up the price. Coincidence? I'm too jaded to believe that.
insider trading has to be the easiest damn thing in the world. discreetly tell someone you know in person a piece of insider knowledge, and let them profit off it, then reimburse you some how. i find it insane people think this isn't happening virtually 100% of the time.
Re: DOJ: Hackers broke into an SEC database and made millions from inside info
#160Earlier quoted context omitted.
insider trading has to be the easiest damn thing in the world. discreetly tell someone you know in person a piece of insider knowledge, and let them profit off it, then reimburse you some how. i find it insane people think this isn't happening virtually 100% of the time.
You say that like people don't get busted for this all the time.