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Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

blogs.scientificamerican.com

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Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#151

Post by AstralStorm »

kimdotcom wrote: post #119
AstralStorm wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of ritual settings, some are allowed already. Perhaps also should be allowed in a medical and research setting which would mean schedule 2 or 3. However, abuse potential or evidence of harm should be first demonstrated before scheduling a substance this high.

So, there is no abuse problem with current Schedule 2 and 3 substances?

There is, but less than before most of this drugs were scheduled.

It used to be even recently that you could get strong opiates for cold and amfetamines for cough, weight loss and lethargy for instance. Or that barbiturates were prescribed for many issues related to insomnia.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#152

Post by deadbunny »

ramblerman wrote: post #101
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

key word being /can/; it's a statement and a belief that IMO is very sensitive to confirmation bias. One of the key points of the psychedelics / soft drugs legalisation effort is that it would allow for a lot less red tape to do medical research on.

> it's a statement and a belief that IMO is very sensitive to confirmation bias. Are you saying people who no longer feel depressed are suffering from confirmation bias? :)

No, Surviorship Bias.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#153

Post by AstralStorm »

1000units wrote: post #137
ada1981 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“New Studies Fail To Find Associations Between Psychedelic Drugs And Mental Health Problems“ http://www.iflscience.com/brain/new-studies-fail-find-associ...

There's also a significant body of literature that does not fail to find such associations.

If there is, then a good meta analysis should be possible or already done.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#154

Post by AstralStorm »

ryanmercer wrote: post #144
kimdotcom wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yet, a Hillbilly Flute can be purchased legally online and delivered to your home. https://www.hillbillystills.com/hillbilly-flute-s/190.htm

Well duh obviously everyone that orders a still is going to use it in their living room as an art installation.

The presumption is that they have the permit.

Unlike firearms, the seller does not have to verify it.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#155

Post by gepi79 »

deno wrote: post #147
1000units wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alcohol can safely be enjoyed in moderation, as countless humans have successfully managed for thousands of years. A single LSD trip can ruin you, as many people have proven in these past tens of years.

A single drunken escapade can ruin your life. What’s your point?

The point is that alcohol is predictable and does not affect your well being after the intoxication. Proven countless times.

Using psychedelics is like playing russian roulette. Proven countless times. The effects of a reasonable dose of psychedelics ranges from weird experience to psychosis (you do not recognize false beliefs) to the worst action you have made.

http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/04/28/why-were-early-psychede...

There is a reason why alcohol and tobacco are accepted in almost all societies while opioids and psychedelics are treated differently.

IMO too many people suffer already from psychosis. E.g. flat earthers, denial of climate change denial, denial of urgent action against climate change, low carb diet is healthy,...

Judging what is real and what not is already difficult for many without psychedelics.

Read about Donald Trump or Scott Pruitt, the ex-EPA administrator.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#156

Post by blubb-fish »

nfoz wrote: post #138
blubb-fish wrote: post #127

For me this is a simple philosophical question. An adult should be allowed to do whatever s/he likes as long as it is not harming others. If harm to others is done - even under the influence - then punishment is due. But as long as somebody just does something in private - it must be okay. I have plenty of experience with psychedlics - be it LSD, Psilocibin, DMT or 4-ACO-DMT. I know from own experience that a bad tri…

For me it's a complex philosophical question without a clear answer. Where I live (downtown of big city) there are a lot of people visibly addicted to drugs, on the streets, generally living lives that appear tragic to themselves and others. We can say "punishment is due" for each offense they take (theft, violence, public nudity, etc.), but it's probably better to describe those as symptoms of a drug addiction. "Pun…

But with this approach to train adults to not take responsibility. I am all for placing full responsibility on every adult - one has to learn to deal with this of course and the current state of society is opposing it. Otherwise people couldn't sue manufacturers for having put their pets into microwave ovens or for getting cancer from smoking. I know this will cause colateral damage from people doing stupid or bad things on drugs - but the opposite isn't much better - to train a generation towards non-responsibility - this is probably causing more damage. We are just used to it. If somebody decides to take drugs and destroy his/her life - that is very sad - but so be it. Those people should be helped - and even this will be easier when taking drugs is not being criminalized.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#157

Post by blubb-fish »

Retric wrote: post #135
blubb-fish wrote: post #127

For me this is a simple philosophical question. An adult should be allowed to do whatever s/he likes as long as it is not harming others. If harm to others is done - even under the influence - then punishment is due. But as long as somebody just does something in private - it must be okay. I have plenty of experience with psychedlics - be it LSD, Psilocibin, DMT or 4-ACO-DMT. I know from own experience that a bad tri…

Markets are not limited to buyers, which means their would be sellers benefiting from and promoting damaging behavior. Now, if the government is manufacturing and selling without advertising that might be closer to the platonic ideal you're describing.

Regulated manufacturing - like with food and then controlled selling like with alcohol, cigarettes or medical drugs.

I mean nothing is bad by itself - we don't prohibit knives b/c people stab each other.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#158

Post by blubb-fish »

tomchristie wrote: post #140
blubb-fish wrote: post #127

For me this is a simple philosophical question. An adult should be allowed to do whatever s/he likes as long as it is not harming others. If harm to others is done - even under the influence - then punishment is due. But as long as somebody just does something in private - it must be okay. I have plenty of experience with psychedlics - be it LSD, Psilocibin, DMT or 4-ACO-DMT. I know from own experience that a bad tri…

> For me this is a simple philosophical question. It really shouldn't be. It's a pragmatic question, based on what the likely outcomes and benefits or harms would be for deregulation. > second of all it is a maturing experience. Psychedelics put you at far higher risk of experiencing psychosis and other mental health issues. Don't rose-tint it as "maturing experience". You might not have an adverse response. Plenty h…

My stance it to place the responsibility for educating yourself about LSD before taking it on an adult. If that adult doesn't do that - then that's no different to me from driving too fast and causing an accident or trying to climb a mountain without proper preparation and equipment.

Adults have the right to die, to suffer and to harm themselves - I prefer to not get there. But I don't see why the state should base laws on this b/c this will also affect the freedom of me and others who act responsible.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#160

Post by forkLding »

I've tried psychedelics before, and I've found them pretty boring in terms of their effects (like a minor VR experience that doesn't go away and leaves headaches) and don't see the point of their classification. I have also since avoided psychedelics because they last so long and you aren't productive during those hours.
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