Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

A letter to my students

blogs.berkeley.edu

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

151–160 of 186 posts

Re: A letter to my students

#151

Post by jbooth »

byrneseyeview wrote: post #139
krschultz wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has not more than doubled . Don't throw around numbers if you haven't actually looked at them. Population in 1960: 15,717,204 Population in 2010: 36,961,664 $28B for 15.7M people is $1783 per person $119B for 37.9M people is $3140 per person. And the costs have increased far faster than inflation, so comparing constant dollars is not an apples to apples comparison. Inflation includes a lot of things, but not every…

The state spends a massive portion of its revenues on education and healthcare, those are two things notoriously increasing in price faster than inflation. I would assume that the government is disproportionately likely to spend on these categories. So isn't this another way to illustrate inefficiency? If there's a correlation between government being a customer, and prices rising while the quality of the end product…

That sounds like you're taking a favored conclusion and arguing backwards.

How many people have health insurance in the US?

How many of those are government employees? (Answer: far less than half)

Is the government running health insurance? (Answer: no).

EDIT: Wasn't trying to get too political on this. I just find the argument "the government buys some health insurance, so that's why it's expensive" outrageously unpersuasive.

Re: A letter to my students

#152

Post by protomyth »

vital101 wrote: post #114

I live in Michigan. It's no secret that Michigan is having severe budget problems. In fact, there are several counties in Michigan (38 comes to mind) that are actually UN-PAVING roads because they are too expensive to maintain. I often wonder how Michigan would look if instead of making tax cuts, and then cutting services, we instead paid .5% more taxes a year to the state. Would it improve our situation? I hope so.…

The raise in taxes might actually have the effect of decreasing the tax base by being the point at which people leave the state. Michigan has a lot of years with a strong Detroit. Now, they have to look at getting new industry and/or belt tightening. It looks like they went for the "in your face" version instead of reducing staff in the counties.

Re: A letter to my students

#153

Post by joe_the_user »

callmeed wrote: post #94
joe_the_user wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe California currently spends a similar amount on prisons as on education. I don't believe that was the case in 1962. That would effect total spending. Whether that means California is doing more for its citizens in this way is a question one can ask.

Err, not even close: 9.6% of the general fund on corrections/rehab programs 43.4% on K-12 education 14.3% on higher education http://www.ebudget.ca.gov/pdf/BudgetSummary/SummaryCharts.pd...

So prisons are merely approaching the cost of higher education, sorry. (9.6% versus 14.3%).

Re: A letter to my students

#155

Post by callmeed »

joe_the_user wrote: post #153
callmeed wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Err, not even close: 9.6% of the general fund on corrections/rehab programs 43.4% on K-12 education 14.3% on higher education http://www.ebudget.ca.gov/pdf/BudgetSummary/SummaryCharts.pd...

So prisons are merely approaching the cost of higher education , sorry. (9.6% versus 14.3%).

How do you know it's approaching? Higher education is 50% higher but I don't know if corrections is growing at a faster rate.

Re: A letter to my students

#156

Post by mudil »

Manhattan Project cost nearly US$2 billion ($22 billion in present day value).(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manhattan_Project) It employed more than 130,000 people. Many labs and plants built in 1940s for the project are still in use today.

We have just spend $760 billion on so-called stimulus. The money is gone, and nothing to show for it.

That's how bloated gov't works nowadays, in CA, federal, and all other states. And the letter is calling for more of this!

PS Great book on Manhattan project: http://www.amazon.com/Making-Atomic-Bomb-Richard-Rhodes/dp/0...

Re: A letter to my students

#157

Post by sabat »

jlangenauer wrote: post #113
patio11 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Using state figures and the CPI calculator: 1965-1966: $4B nominal ($28B, constant 2010 dollars) 1982-1983: $25.3B nominal ($57.2B) 2008-2009: $144B ($145) 2009-2010: $119.2B ($119.2B) Even if you adjust for California's prodigious immigration-fueled population growth, spending per person in constant dollars has more than doubled. You spent your school years with teachers paid less and less. I feel the urge to get ou…

I can't speak for California, but certainly here in Australia, there's been one factor increasing the cost of higher education: the rise of a managerial class within universities, who cost plenty but whose contribution to education and research is questionable. It'd be almost impossible to quantify - and it is probably only one of several factors - but the take-home point is that increased spending isn't necessarily…

Absolutely the same case in California. Along with other corporate giveaways and general waste. And no one willing to take responsibility for getting rid of it -- they're too busy making deals with the beneficiaries.

Re: A letter to my students

#158

Post by yters »

korch wrote: post #92

Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers. —Socrates These kind of education articles are fucking stupid and only help fan the flames on all sides of deeply f…

And Athens fell because they used up their money.

Re: A letter to my students

#159

Post by commandar »

korch wrote: post #92

Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers. —Socrates These kind of education articles are fucking stupid and only help fan the flames on all sides of deeply f…

>Old people forget what it was like to be young, and lose their ability to rapidly adapt and learn as children do. And without fail, each generation grows up to believe they were somehow better than later generations.

I don't think this is an accurate description of the article at all. The author is specifically arguing that his generation has violated the social contract that they used to their gain, leaving the current, younger generation holding the bag.

He's not saying "goddamn kids these days"; he's encouraging the upcoming generation to fix what their parents (his generation) have screwed up so that the generation after them doesn't end up shackled in the same way or worse. In fact, he's encouraging them to engage their parents ("they still vote") to help them in fixing things.

Re: A letter to my students

#160

Post by epoxyhockey »

commandar wrote: post #159
korch wrote: post #92

Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers. —Socrates These kind of education articles are fucking stupid and only help fan the flames on all sides of deeply f…

>Old people forget what it was like to be young, and lose their ability to rapidly adapt and learn as children do. And without fail, each generation grows up to believe they were somehow better than later generations. I don't think this is an accurate description of the article at all. The author is specifically arguing that his generation has violated the social contract that they used to their gain, leaving the cur…

The professor doesn't adequately quantify what has gone wrong due to a generation's alleged lack of paying it forward. Generalizations like "failing infrastructure" and "less spending on schools" do not exactly get the fire started in my belly - because I don't see anything glaringly wrong with those items. And, maybe this old man's view of a failing infrastructure is a result of something petty like a crack in the sidewalk directly outside of his house.

And, maybe his generation has spent less time worrying about cracks in sidewalks and potholes in roads because they were investing in things that are now more foreign to an older person. Like biotech, wireless tech, green tech, etc. (I'm sure there are better examples)

BTW - I just used the term "old man" to add impact to my statement. I love my older generation and the insights they bring.

Post reply on HN