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Crony capitalism may be cannibalizing productive capitalism in the U.S.

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151–160 of 263 posts

Re: Crony capitalism may be cannibalizing productive capitalism in the U.S.

#151
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "First, let's assume the cow is a sphere". It is worse than that, because at least physics is validated by experimental data. Much of (macro in particular) Economics is a set of axioms that are seldom predictive.

Yes. Macroeconomics is secular theology. The global economy is so vast and interconnected that basically none of the theory can be scientifically tested.

Apparently at Renaissance Technologies they love hiring astronomers because as an astronomer you are used to modelling systems that are completely beyond human scale based on data from observations that cannot be repeated.

No one would argue that astronomy isn't a science. Traditional university macroeconomics is a different beast. Comparison with astrology is apt.

Re: Crony capitalism may be cannibalizing productive capitalism in the U.S.

#152
post #117
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Does it seem to anyone else that the finance industry is increasingly distracted from actually matching up capital to fundamentally productive companies, especially new companies? This is somewhat controversial to posit, but I believe the corruption in the financial industry is extraordinarily entrenched because of the Fed. Before you call me a lunatic, smart and good people from Aaron Schwartz to Sanders have said…

You're saying we should get rid of the financial industry? What, because we're all so good at managing our own money? Guaranteeing the big banks can't fail is how we keep the economy going. If a bank fails, everyone that is owed money by that bank fails too. Is that acceptable? Would you be fine with your employer going belly up because the bank they rely on can't pay out money?

Guaranteeing the big banks can't fail is a source of moral hazard, removing the cost of being wrong from those taking the risk and transferring it to the general public. Make the banks responsible for the negative consequences of their actions with no potential for bailout, and watch their behavior change.

Re: Crony capitalism may be cannibalizing productive capitalism in the U.S.

#153
post #81

I think that these issues are getting a lot of attention recently. A lot of people feel that their jobs are not meaningful anymore and that they cannot find any meaningful work that pays well. Most of the jobs that pay well are zero-sum games. Finance, tech, law. Even medicine and pharmaceuticals are becoming zero-sum games (e.g companies boosting drug prices because it's easier than inventing new ones). People have…

Thats why we need space colonization. We as a species are programmed to expand. We have become stagnant in the last 100 years.

We have become stagnant in the last 100 years.

Are you serious? Do you know how much mankind has accomplished since 1917?

Re: Crony capitalism may be cannibalizing productive capitalism in the U.S.

#154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not that we are so efficient, but that a priviledged tiny cabal have learned how to push the consequences of their mistakes to the rest of the population. To borrow your example: In agricultural age, if you fucked up harvest your family starves. Today, if you fuck up the housing market, thousand of families end up in bankrupcy, and tens of thousands of small investors loose their savings... but you do not perso…

> There's historic precedent for that kind of divorce between actions and consequences, and it is not pretty. There's a certain French doctor you should google: his name's Josheph Guillotin. I'm not sure what analogy you are going for. Guillotin did not invent the guillotine, and only advertised it as a more humane way of execution. He was opposed to the death penalty.

They're referring to the French Revolution, and then the Terror. One of the causes of the revolution was the poor being fed up with the massive wealth imbalance. An economic depression was making the masses starve in the streets, while the wealthy 1% enjoyed lives of comfort and luxury enabled by the rigged aristocratic land-owning system. So the peasants had their bloody revolution, killed a lot of the aristocrats using Dr. Guillotine's invention, and now we have modern France.

(This is, of course, a gross oversimplification of a complex historical topic. Please feel free to correct me.)

Re: Crony capitalism may be cannibalizing productive capitalism in the U.S.

#155
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not the endgame of all capitalists. Actual capitalists, limited in number as they are, prefer free markets (e.g. no cronyism) because they'll make more money that way over time. Opportunists are the ones who thrive when things are rigged. They can't survive on their own. But yes, many capitalists (and non-capitalists alike) "buy" regulatory advantages. Some leverage their dollars (buying) Some leverage their num…

> You will find no practical solution to this problem other than starving the beast (decentralizing power away from government) All this will lead to is dictatorship by the wealthy. I much prefer our current system, as flawed as it is, to corporate fascism.

Disagree. It is our current system, which increasingly empowers opportunists over capitalists, that will create "corporate fascism."

Current system:

1) Big companies pay minimal or negative taxes. Small companies are taxed at the individual rate (and increasing). If Company A pays 0% at top bracket, and Company B pays 50%, Company B is unlikely to out-compete Company A.

Read: our tax system creates "monopolies."

2) Our current system allows big companies to write or shape gov regulations, making compliance only possible for the largest companies. Prohibiting health ins cos from selling across state lines is an example.

Read: overreaching laws and regulations create "monopolies."

3) Our current system provides a safety net to large companies, who have leveraged #1 and #2 above in order to become "systemic." This gives them a greater tolerance for risk, "counterbalancing" regulations notwithstanding.

Read: death spiral

Want to fight "corporate fascism?"

Shrink a "corporate fascist's" source of power.

Their power comes not from creating superior products or services, and delivering these at a superior price. It comes from their ability to manipulate corrupt or dumb politicians, bureaucrats, and voters.

Again, you will find no practical solution to this problem other than starving the beast.

Re: Crony capitalism may be cannibalizing productive capitalism in the U.S.

#156
This article speaks to a larger problem with the U.S., and really global system of finance. Right now we live in a world where finance dictates production, rather than production dictating finance. Combine that with the massive concentration of wealth on a global scale and we can observe a very real problem that will continue to hinder global progress until it is addressed. So often we as a collective naturalize the institution as if it was not an economic technology that we have created. Over time all technologies need updating, and our economic models are no different.

As Harvard's Roberto Unger often says, "Finance has become a bad master, instead of a good servant."

Re: Crony capitalism may be cannibalizing productive capitalism in the U.S.

#157
post #114
post #27

Does it seem to anyone else that the finance industry is increasingly distracted from actually matching up capital to fundamentally productive companies, especially new companies? Looking at the stock market, there are few IPOs, and after IPO, being public only provides access to limited access vis issuance of new stock... Some capital flows to VCs, but it seems the more capital flows to large VC funds, the more the…

You're not limited to stock. You can purchase options or futures, or play around with foreign exchanges. IPOs show up more rarely because it's SUPPOSED to be hard to start a new business. You can approach companies to try and buy into their model by investing your cash - nothing is stopping you. As for VC companies controlling the cash, that's not the whole picture. Being dependent on "free cash" from VC's is a prett…

My point is once the stock on the exchange, all the churn, the purchases and sales, the futures and options have an increasingly tenuous link with encouraging capital to select for better fundamental productivity. Worse, by the time a company is publicly traded, you're really often just in the 'execution' phase of expanding an already established process. This isn't terrible, it's useful - but my main concern is capitalization of fundamental improvements in our economy at an earlier stage than a stock is 'bottlenecked' at the moment and so the financial market has a limited set of options of truly productive places to apply excess capital.

Part of that is large companies (with a handful of exceptions) perform optimization focused on accounting measurements and predictions to maximize their existing margins. This makes perfect logical measurable sense, except that over multiple decades of refined MBA practices, it makes almost all them good some local optimization, and increasingly bad at new ventures(or fundamentally changing their approach to existing ventures). Then to break out of that local optimization, some increased investment is required that large companies are punished for if/when their profit margin drops.

So local optimizations are explored to a endpoint, and capital starts chasing higher returns - we get rentier behivior, or capital flows into bubble assets that pop up or get chased around the world in various categories - all while produtivity and growth slowly flatlines... or at least misses its potential.

This has been recognized for a while w.r.t large companies, and so the generally accepted approach is for many of them to acquire new companies to get new capability. So we get to VCs. They don't want to invest in junk, but when VCs apply quantitative filters to because they want a sure thing investment - but moving the same quantitive model to uncertain ventures just moves that some of same 'large company' problem to an earlier stage. I'm not saying to get rid of VCs, they perform a reasonable function now, but something feels off.

I'll leave off a whole discussion of where new companies can come from outside of VCs, but there are some factors holding that back (and others helping), but in general it think that's in decline and that our larger markets depended on that creation more than they realize.

So to me, it feels like the overall financial system is missing opportunities - and that part is possibly hinted at in data, at least at the gross productivity growth falloff of the economy.

Re: Crony capitalism may be cannibalizing productive capitalism in the U.S.

#158
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or simply, our means of production have become so efficient that it didn't matter whether you were right or wrong, things would still hum along and the profits would continue. In the agricultural age, if you fucked up a harvest, you and your family could starve. Before agriculture, if you fucked up a hunt, your whole kin-clan could starve. Nowadays, if you fuck up the housing market, and millions of people go bankrup…

Many people have proposed variations of this as the reason civilizations collapse. They are destroyed by their success. They gain so much surplus that it completely isolates them from any kind of feedback mechanism, over time causing them to completely rot from within. Eventually the core becomes so rotten that the whole system falls apart. This can be sudden. I think an intuitive grasp of this is why so many conserv…

That's really interesting. Makes me think about what the feedback mechanism could be.

A high rate / corp tax rate that's proportional to an objective inequality measure?

Trouble is taxation is avoided but it is the only thing that really stings.

Re: Crony capitalism may be cannibalizing productive capitalism in the U.S.

#159
What the article says is true - banking, patents, regulations, corporate subsidies all contribute to rent-seeking behaviour. But one cannot strike a balance between rent-seeking and value-producing behaviour without investigating the motivation behind. Is it greed and laziness working in tandem? Or something else? I honestly have no answer

Re: Crony capitalism may be cannibalizing productive capitalism in the U.S.

#160
The choice of title is interesting, if a bit misleading, so I'm gonna run with this. It's often suggested that there are two types of capitalism: one productive, competitive and free -- the other gripped with cronyism, protectionism, and exploitation. I don't buy that. There is just one type of capitalism, and while at times it may look more like one or the other of these poles, it always tends toward the latter: monopolistic, state-sanctioned "crony capitalism" that puts allows business owners to prioritize their own profits over the collective good. That's not to say that the sky is always falling: Scandinavian countries enjoy healthy markets and don't have absurd corporate welfare, for instance, it's just that the incentives for "good capitalists" to become cronyists are always present.

The problem with the "two types" thinking is that it is always in a person's a person's best interest to get something for free. Ironically, this rhetoric is often used by capitalists, fearful that leftism might become effective, by claiming their opponents are the ones who want free stuff. There are lots of ways to get things for free. For instance, you can steal your workers time and fail to compensate them (common in fast food), you can coerce a government into cooperation ("We'll move to India if you don't give us the tax breaks") or you can campaign to get your friends into the government.

The fallacy of libertarianism is a belief that capitalists don't want a state mechanism with the power to tax and regulate. That is exactly what capitalists want. They're given state protection via a police or military force, state welfare through tax write-offs and incentives, power and influence in crafting legislation that fits your worldview, and less turbulent markets due to stifling of demand. The alternative is Hobbes' "short, nasty, brutish" life - duking it out eternally trying to achieve efficiency instead of excess, competing endlessly, only to profit in the slightest.

It's often said that "it's in our nature to be competitive" but it's also in our nature to be cooperative, and corporations display this fact amazingly well- they use collective influence and power in numbers to achieve ends that small businesses never could. Until people outside of that system learn to cooperate well enough to bargain for their own interests (e.g. Labor movements), it's going to be smooth sailing for the "crony" capitalists.

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