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H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

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Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#151

Post by danielweber »

d3ad1ysp0rk wrote: post #148
danielweber wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TurboTax found several thousand dollars for me in a fairly complicated tax situation that I was completely not expecting and would never have realized on my own. Even some CPAs I've talked to have said "oh, really?" They've bought some tremendous goodwill from me with that. I'm probably sticking with them forever.

This is the exact anecdote for why Intuit would want to keep tax law complicated.

How do you think carryover losses of subchapter S corporations should be handled to make them easier?

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#152

Post by tvanantwerp »

arebop wrote: post #36
serg_chernata wrote: post #9

Is there anything we can do to fight back?

I would gladly match my tax prep fee with a donation to the counter-lobby, if one existed. Where can I buy tax-complexity-offsets?

I work for the Tax Foundation, a nonpartisan tax policy think tank. As a 501(c)3 we're not allowed to lobby, but we do work hard to show legislators the benefits of taxes that are simple, transparent, neutral, and stable.

https://taxfoundation.org/principles/

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#153

Post by frgtpsswrdlame »

John23832 wrote: post #135
frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure but your answer seems to be excusing their action. You said that it was never wrong for them to lobby. I'd say that this case is a perfect example of when lobbying is "wrong."

Your problem is with the actions that they're lobbying for, not the lobbying itself. If H&R Block instead lobbied for clean water for all US citizens, you wouldn't have an issue with that. It is ok to think that the cause (complicating the tax code) is wrong, but the methods (lobbying) are ok.

I'm not sure how you can seperate the two. You say that lobbying is never wrong but if "the actions that they're lobbying for" are wrong it would seem to me that the lobbying in that instance is wrong as well.

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#154

Post by sp332 »

sly010 wrote: post #134
sp332 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 1040EZ is a single page and has only 2 pages of instructions. How does it take 7 hours? http://datechguyblog.com/2011/04/15/7-hours-for-form-1040ez-... (Link from 2011 but I don't remember it being much different lately.) Edit: the IRS now says it takes 3 hours to fill out and submit the form, and 2 hours to collect the relevant paperwork, for 5 total. https://www.irs.gov/instructions/i1040gi/ar03.html

"1040EZ" is an eaaasssy version of 1040. He is specifially talking about filling "1040".

The part I'm responding to: "The 1040EZ is supposed to take 7 hours."

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#155

Post by jungturk »

John23832 wrote: post #48
cheriot wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The prime objective for a business is to make money." A business is a way for people to organize and collaborate and it does not absolve those people of their moral and ethical obligations. Individuals are expected to prioritize family, community, country, religion, etc. We need to stop giving people a free pass just because they hide behind articles of incorporation.

What are you going to do, put a business in jail? Hold the people who have made you promises and then failed to follow through responsible. Aka, your politicians. They are your backstop. What makes Goldman, GSK, Haliburton, or any of the other shady, scummy businesses out there responsible to you? They are responsible to the law on the books. Our politicians are supposed to prevent business from screwing our society.…

The charter granted to the business can contain clauses requiring the business to attend to more than just its own returns.

The state or the people grant that charter to the business, with the benefits its confers regarding liability and taxation, so we could decide to do so only if the business commits to the terms.

There's no inalienable right to incorporation in the US constitution - the corporation is a statutory fiction we've all agreed to use.

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#156

Post by BrandonM »

For anyone who can program (including spreadsheets!), it's not all that hard to file your own taxes the old-fashioned way. To do it digitally, just use https://www.freefilefillableforms.com/ and start with a 1040. Read each line carefully and go from there.

The IRS has tons of great resources, and you can even call them up. Each form has a companion instruction booklet (online PDF), and sometimes those instructions refer to an IRS publication with additional clarification. If you can read a technical blog post and follow a clear procedure, you can file your own taxes.

I've been filing taxes the (new) old-fashioned way for my wife and I for the last 3 years. That includes 330+ days abroad (Federal Earned Income Exclusion), a sole proprietorship, an LLC, an ISO exercise (AMT), 3 separate states, and 5 separate cities.

Each time, it has taken me a full 12-16 hours (a solid day or two on a weekend) for federal, multiple states, and multiple cities. It's not the most fun, but by the end of it, I understand our taxes and finances a lot better. We can arrange our situation better going forward. We can keep more appropriate records to make the next year's filings easier. And most of all, I have the satisfaction of not funding an industry that lobbies against my interests.

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#157

Post by gcr »

jawns wrote: post #74

Because of the complexity of tax regulations, I don't think coming up with a competing free/open-source/nonprofit tax preparation service is the right answer to this problem. Let's consider the positions of all sides: * The professional tax preparers are worried that they're going to lose business if the government assumes the bulk of the tax preparation work. * We as taxpayers would prefer that the government pre-fi…

I'm confused about Step 2. Please remind me why I would want to allow the IRS to send all of my personal and financial history to a third party?

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#158

Post by chillacy »

John23832 wrote: post #104
M_Grey wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it incumbent on politicians to be moral, "do the right things", but not businesses? That's a laughably arbitrary choice you're making.

Because "morality" is a uniquely human trait, and we elect politicians to enact laws (which are group morality, codified). We pay businesses for goods and services.

Aren't businesses run by humans? The government is run by people too, are they incapable of morality as well?

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#159

Post by __david__ »

mabbo wrote: post #52
atonse wrote: post #24

Could we not start a non-profit that builds software as good as H&R block and allows people to file their own taxes?

A lot of what H&R Block sells is experience in filing taxes, not just knowledge of how to do it. I have complex multi-country taxes to file (Canadian living in Canada, but with some income the IRS says is American income). H&R Block have a guy who has handled this exact kind of tax filing hundreds of times before. If I make any mis-steps in filing, the IRS is going to demand I give them thousands of dollars. I'm not…

> Canadian living in Canada, but with some income the IRS says is American income…

So in that case, I'm curious what the penalty is for not paying. Presumably the IRS doesn't have the power to garnish wages from Canadian banks…

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#160

Post by latimer »

berberous wrote: post #131
naftaliharris wrote: post #121

I'm surprised the article and comments haven't mentioned CreditKarma's tax solution yet, which is (actually) free. [1] Presumably their strategy is to take the users and data they get from offering free tax filing and use them to advertise lending products. I think that's a sustainable and politically feasible way to get free tax filing, actually; I expect that in ~5 years Credit Karma will have eaten a big part of T…

I have not used CreditKarma's tax product, but I've heard folks say that it calculates some things incorrectly. I think that's understandable for a brand new product, but I'd be cautious about using it this year if you don't (1) have a very simple return, (2) check their work against the IRS forms/instructions and/or (3) check against another product. (For those who don't want to give TurboTax or H&R money, I've been…

I haven't used CreditKarma's tax product either so I can't speak to its accuracy, but from my understanding they didn't build their own product, they acquired a company called AFJC which has been in the online tax space for a while.
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