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On Loneliness

krishnamurti-teachings.info

151–160 of 190 posts

Re: On Loneliness

#151

Of course I'm going to get flamed for this but this guy has written a bunch of nonsense. "Love and emptiness cannot abide together; when there is the feeling of loneliness, love is not. " 1. Emptiness is not the same thing as loneliness. 2. If you feel anything bad while you think you feel empty then that's not actual emptiness. 3. When you practice true love for others it makes you lonely because it makes everyone a…

>"When you practice true love for others it makes you lonely because it makes everyone abandon you."

What do you mean by this? In your opinion, what makes true love incompatible with connectness?

Re: On Loneliness

#152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gita doesn't say that God created the caste system. The four "varnas" are loosely translated as "castes" but that is not quite so. A varna is defined by an individual's occupation. Those who teach are brahmanas, those engaged in ruling the kingdom and protecting people are kshatriyas, those involved in business are vaishyas and those performing jobs like construction, farming etc. are shudras. It is unfortunate that…

> There is no parallel to the teachings of Gita.. Well there is Ashtavakra Gita, personally I liked the asthavakra more as its context is more refined.

Yes, Ashtavakra Gita is a vedantic text that focuses on describing the absolute truth.

Bhagavad Gita is more versatile since it covers the many aspects of action (karma), devotion (bhakti) and knowledge (jnana). The highest truth about the Self is described in a few verses that are sprinkled throughout the text and many other aspects such as creation of universe, modes of mind, action, renunciation, imbibing godly qualities, shunning demonic qualities etc. are all found in it. Shankaracharya's commentary on it makes it very special too.

Re: On Loneliness

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are quite a lot of gems out there in various cultures. Have you read Chuang Tzu? He's deeply insightful. But a word of caution that the effect of mere words wears off, and more seriously, it is trivial to misunderstand the intended meaning of these various masters. When I was young, it chafed me to read about the novice-master relationship (which is stressed in almost all spiritual schools regardless of time or…

Experience is the master and the truth. He who controls the data controls the learner. - @pmddomingos

> He who controls the data controls the learner.

"Have you considered the case of him who has taken his own lower self for his god ..." - Q.45:23

Re: On Loneliness

#154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm having similar problems understanding your post as I do with understanding his writings. This discussion would have probably been a lot more productive if either of you defined what in the world do you mean by "love"/"true love", because you're using a lot of the emotional load typically placed there to define concepts that seem to be different.

> I'm having similar problems understanding your post as I do with understanding his writings. How do you confirm the similarity of the problems? One thing's for sure - I can help you get more concrete understanding the more you ask me concrete questions and check. The same cannot be said of Krishnamurti's teaching as his words cannot be verified (they lack verifiable problems). Feel free to ask me any questions you…

>"You probably just missed it, but I certainly did define it concretely"

Is this the definition you're referring to?

>"Love is blessing. Blessings are that which enable or cause a good result for something or for it to change for the better."

Has this view of 'love is blessing' changed your life? What has it helped you with?

Re: On Loneliness

#155

Of course I'm going to get flamed for this but this guy has written a bunch of nonsense. "Love and emptiness cannot abide together; when there is the feeling of loneliness, love is not. " 1. Emptiness is not the same thing as loneliness. 2. If you feel anything bad while you think you feel empty then that's not actual emptiness. 3. When you practice true love for others it makes you lonely because it makes everyone a…

>"When you practice true love for others it makes you lonely because it makes everyone abandon you." What do you mean by this? In your opinion, what makes true love incompatible with connectness?

Love is not incompatible with connectedness. The very way of the world is love. So people who are alive cannot exactly not be "unified".

But people do what I described because they have different destinies than you. It takes them a long time to come to know facts because they can't understand or accept what you had to open your mouth to tell them right off the bat. The reason is that we, who are ordinary people who are not enlightened, do not really recognize the causes we carry within our own consciousnesses. We only witness results/effects and don't fully perceive the problems that made them become that way. So even if you could predict the future people can't accept what you say without their own verification.

But people only take exactly what they are ready to take even from a perfect teaching. Basically, people hear what they want to hear. Plus, it's really arduous to change for the better in most cases. So people who have such things in them have to distance themselves from you if you retain your sincerity as it's hard for them to stay near a person who doesn't agree with their expectation that they're right. Their pride feels hurt.

Eventually, if your words were true (true love), then they have the chance to come to know you in the future, after they confirm and experience lots of things through their own living. But it's hard for them to reapproach you if what they have done made Karma inside of their consciousness. And that's provided they don't destroy or lose themselves in the process.

Re: On Loneliness

#156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm having similar problems understanding your post as I do with understanding his writings. How do you confirm the similarity of the problems? One thing's for sure - I can help you get more concrete understanding the more you ask me concrete questions and check. The same cannot be said of Krishnamurti's teaching as his words cannot be verified (they lack verifiable problems). Feel free to ask me any questions you…

>"You probably just missed it, but I certainly did define it concretely" Is this the definition you're referring to? >"Love is blessing. Blessings are that which enable or cause a good result for something or for it to change for the better." Has this view of 'love is blessing' changed your life? What has it helped you with?

Yes, that's correct. Excellent questions. If you want to understand the definition of love correctly you need to learn conscience and justice first of all. Conscience is the way to brighten one's mind, and justice is the way to brighten our world. Is there any greater blessing than living with a bright mind in a bright world ?

Re: On Loneliness

#157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Experience is the master and the truth. He who controls the data controls the learner. - @pmddomingos

> He who controls the data controls the learner. "Have you considered the case of him who has taken his own lower self for his god ..." - Q.45:23

Fatalism doesn't really appeal.

Re: On Loneliness

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He who controls the data controls the learner. "Have you considered the case of him who has taken his own lower self for his god ..." - Q.45:23

Fatalism doesn't really appeal.

You are making an assumption regarding the balance between predetermination and free will. Entirely your reading.

Re: On Loneliness

#159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"One gets all the validation one needs, not from teachers or gurus, but by direct experiential knowledge." Sure, I have no problem with that. However, if you let your past experiences define who you are, it'll always limit you, even if your past experiences include 'glimpses of the absolute'. Simply put, the most common mode of human existence is that of a storyteller. If you see connections between event A and even…

I couldn't say since I'm not living with that realization. Here are the words of someone who does: http://biroco.com/journal.htm

This is a goof example of what I was referring to...

>"Push the details of life back into the mist and just sit with knowing that 'I am'. Why's that of any great interest? I'll tell you why. Because I didn't know I was, and then I did, and that amazing fact is somewhat skirted over being concerned about anything else."

This is the storyteller considering that 'I am God' makes everything else seem trivial in comparison. Why would you do ordinary human things when you see yourself as a God?

Ultimately it just seems like a waste of time to me, to deny yourself the richness of external experience just to trip on the magnificence of your self-image.

Re: On Loneliness

#160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"When you practice true love for others it makes you lonely because it makes everyone abandon you." What do you mean by this? In your opinion, what makes true love incompatible with connectness?

Love is not incompatible with connectedness. The very way of the world is love. So people who are alive cannot exactly not be "unified". But people do what I described because they have different destinies than you. It takes them a long time to come to know facts because they can't understand or accept what you had to open your mouth to tell them right off the bat. The reason is that we, who are ordinary people who a…

>"But people only take exactly what they are ready to take even from a perfect teaching."

I agree that to be prepared for an idea makes someone more receptive to it. I find the same thing with creative thinking as a whole. When I've taken the time to reflect on an puzzle, I'm more receptive to a solution.

Regarding the other points you raised about love, another question... Is sincerity important for true love? Or to put it another way, can illusory actions be conducted in a loving way?

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