Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's neither flexible nor semantic. Flexibility is what allowed webpages to be "responsive" before media-queries even existed, and semantics is what allows accessibility, search engines, and other html parsing tools ("readability" in Firefox and Safari, ...) to function better. The only advantage it has is that it's old and predictable. That's why it's still used to format emails for instance, it's reliable and works…
Most divsoup-layouts are not semantic at all, either.
CSS Grid – Table layout is back. Be there and be square
151–160 of 280 posts
Re: CSS Grid – Table layout is back. Be there and be square
#152Earlier quoted context omitted.
What, exactly, is the problem with the tag in the first place? Been a long, long time since I last touched HTML
It's neither flexible nor semantic. Flexibility is what allowed webpages to be "responsive" before media-queries even existed, and semantics is what allows accessibility, search engines, and other html parsing tools ("readability" in Firefox and Safari, ...) to function better. The only advantage it has is that it's old and predictable. That's why it's still used to format emails for instance, it's reliable and works…
ungrid.css [0]
@media (min-width: 30em) {
.row { width: 100%; display: table; table- layout: fixed; }
.col { display: table-cell; }
}
[0] http://chrisnager.github.io/ungrid/Re: CSS Grid – Table layout is back. Be there and be square
#153Earlier quoted context omitted.
Nothing. But tables are for tabular data. Laying out a page using a table to divide it up and make it look pretty (or in lots of cases, lay it out so it performs some kind of sales based task) doesn't make much sense. Hence the preferred CSS route, even if the markup is just as verbose (as mentioned in this thread). Web apps aside [sigh], if one was to disable CSS (and thus all the blocks making it look pretty), the…
But why is that beneficial?
Re: CSS Grid – Table layout is back. Be there and be square
#154This is excellent. And with the fast pace of browsers, and the improved habits of users (or automatic updates), it should be available for 95%+ of users within a year (It's in the current Safari Technology Preview, so Safari should get it with the next macOS point update). This is also a good moment to remind people that you don't need Bootstrap and the like as much as you used to. Grids were 90% or the reason people…
> it should be available for 95%+ of users within a year only if you don't have enterprise customers. Those will continue to run IE11 for the foreseeable future as IE11 will remain supported in Windows 10 until 2025. While Microsoft is pushing Edge as an IE replacement, Edge is still lacking features and looks too different from IE for companies to feel comfortable pushing it to their users without retraining them.
Re: CSS Grid – Table layout is back. Be there and be square
#155Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's neither flexible nor semantic. Flexibility is what allowed webpages to be "responsive" before media-queries even existed, and semantics is what allows accessibility, search engines, and other html parsing tools ("readability" in Firefox and Safari, ...) to function better. The only advantage it has is that it's old and predictable. That's why it's still used to format emails for instance, it's reliable and works…
Most divsoup-layouts are not semantic at all, either.
Re: CSS Grid – Table layout is back. Be there and be square
#156Fortunately, I've found that it's quite easy to get to grips with - especially if you have been around long enough to have sliced designs into table layouts!
Now for a rather shameless plug for my own article on the subject (I hope with a closer to real world example):
http://maketea.co.uk/2016/09/28/css-grid-layout-is-a-step-ch...
Re: CSS Grid – Table layout is back. Be there and be square
#157I don't know how to say it politely but what has been achieved by using ad-hoc syntax such as this gem (and similar complex CSS syntax): display: grid; grid-template-rows: 150px [nav-start] auto 100px [nav-end]; grid-template-columns: [header-start] minmax(200px, 3fr) 9fr [header-end]; CSS fans for some reason seem to think that its somehow better to have rendering/presentational properties in an ad-hoc language. Ori…
Originally, it was not known that HTML pages would be so finely designed. It is not a naieve dichotomy, it is an attainable ideal that has had a very positive effect on the state of the web. We owe huge thanks to this movement that lead both to the demise of proprietary browser extensions (like flash) and to the awesome technologies in browsers today such as these CSS features, new HTML elements and transport protoco…
Don't get me wrong. I praise CSS for it has given designers ways to come up with new UI idioms (something I'm personally fascinated with). But I will say this has happened in spite of, rather than because of, CSS's qualities. Designers other than outright CSS nerds are struggling with CSS, and CSS is lacking badly from a basic maintainability perspective IMHO. CSS as a language puts an unnecessarily high cognitive burden on casual web developers by lacking a construct to capture the "intent" of a couple coordinated CSS rules; as a result, unless you're doing CSS every day, you're easily lost in your (or someone else's) CSS.
This isn't helped by seemingly arbitrary decisions as to what goes into CSS vs. HTML. For example, responsive images eg. the `picture` element became an HTML element, but arguably should have been subject to CSS media queries instead.
Which is kindof my initial point: that the HTML/CSS dichotomy is accidental and pointless from a language theory PoV.
Re: CSS Grid – Table layout is back. Be there and be square
#158This is excellent. And with the fast pace of browsers, and the improved habits of users (or automatic updates), it should be available for 95%+ of users within a year (It's in the current Safari Technology Preview, so Safari should get it with the next macOS point update). This is also a good moment to remind people that you don't need Bootstrap and the like as much as you used to. Grids were 90% or the reason people…
Since you included the element in your list, something I wish browsers provided is a way to automatically format time elements based on user's preferences. I just want to provide the value in ISO8601, and let the browser take care of it. Luckily, Intl.DateTimeFormat [0] seems to finally allow a reasonable degree of i18n in the browser. If you can live with the limited Safari availability, of course. [0] https://devel…
What you suggest would make that difficult if not impossible. Already it is unnecessarily hard, as JS Date object automatically uses local tz and cannot be coerced otherwise.
Re: CSS Grid – Table layout is back. Be there and be square
#159Re: CSS Grid – Table layout is back. Be there and be square
#160Earlier quoted context omitted.
What, exactly, is the problem with the tag in the first place? Been a long, long time since I last touched HTML
There's no problem. But sometime around 2003 it became trendy to do all layout in CSS, even when a table or a tag would do just fine.