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The iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus Review: Iterating on a Flagship

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Re: The iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus Review: Iterating on a Flagship

#151

Post by pavelrub »

davidf18 wrote: post #124
pavelrub wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hearing some background noise when taking to somebody in Starbucks isn't "critically important".

It is indicative of more challenging situations where it can be a problem hearing people speaking because of background noise. For many, being heard clearly on the phone or hearing people on the phone without background noise is critically important.

Having the general ability to hear and be heard clearly on the phone is indeed critically important. Expecting it to be possible at all times and with zero background noise isn't, and nobody expects this from his/her phone. Nor am I sure what your Starbucks example is indicative of. All it tells us is that iPhone 7 has worse noise cancellation than iPhone 5s, not that iPhone 5s cancels all noise at all times. The existence of "challenging situations where it can be a problem hearing people speaking because of background noise" exists for both phones. Even if the threshold is lower for the iPhone 7, it is unclear how this difference is "critically important".

Re: The iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus Review: Iterating on a Flagship

#152

Post by madeofpalk »

_0w8t wrote: post #104
op00to wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When the $200 phone bursts into flames, are you able to sue the Chinese manufacturer for damages? When your $200 phone breaks, do you have to simply buy a new one rather than get it replaced? When there are security holes in your $200 phone, will the cheap skin over Android get patched? I buy Apple phones for one reason, and that's the fact that my business lives and dies through communication. With my $800 phone, I…

In Norway in Apple-certified stores you will have to wait a week or more for reparation. And they do not provide a replacement in the meantime...

Huh really? I wonder why it's different in Norway? Apple-cerified service providers offer on-the-spot replacements elsewhere in the world (at least in the UK, US and Aus)

Apple in Norway offers IT departments (which manage over 1000 iOS devices) boxes of replacement iPhones so they can swap devices immediately themselves. I would be extremely surprised if this wasn't also available to AASPs http://www.apple.com/no/support/programs/ssa/

Re: The iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus Review: Iterating on a Flagship

#153

Post by madeofpalk »

schwarze_pest wrote: post #136
matwood wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apple marketing simply has succeeded in convincing you and others that there is no viable alternative which in turn keeps you from accepting such a possibility Speaking of FUD. Marketing only gets you so far, and at some point you have to have a product. I have tried to switch to Android. First with an HTC One and another time with the Nexus 5 (I also have a Nexus 7). Android definitely wins on open and customizati…

> I think Google is finally recognizing this, and attempting to replicate it with the Pixel. They are still not there with Pixel. As long as they don't have their own SoC, there won't be proper long time support for their phones.

I don't buy this. Apple didn't always have their own SoC, and support didn't miraculously get better with the iPhone 4 when they introduced it.

Re: The iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus Review: Iterating on a Flagship

#154

Post by criddell »

r00fus wrote: post #147
criddell wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the price difference that significant? To me, the difference between a $1000 phone and a $400 is less than $1 per day (I keep my phones for 24 months). A buck a day is something I can afford and am willing to pay it for even a modestly better phone. I would guess a lot of HN readers are in a similar position. I wish Google would have come out with something much better even if it would have been more expensive tha…

There is value in looking at amortized price, but keep in mind many people (esp. fans) upgrade more frequently than 24mo. For them the cost differential is much sharper and more frequent. Also add in the fact that unlike on the Apple side, most of the Android customer base can simply wait a few months or even weeks and get a much better price (see: most LG phones based on my research), or the same specs from a differ…

Upgrading annually is still within reach for most people, especially if they are enthusiasts. It costs around $2 per day if you want a new phone every year.

Your Android comment is spot on. I'm wary though of comparing specs because that can be misleading. A couple of phones ago I had a OnePlus One which looked marvelous on paper and it ended up being a terrible phone.

Re: The iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus Review: Iterating on a Flagship

#155

Post by davidf18 »

pavelrub wrote: post #151
davidf18 wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is indicative of more challenging situations where it can be a problem hearing people speaking because of background noise. For many, being heard clearly on the phone or hearing people on the phone without background noise is critically important.

Having the general ability to hear and be heard clearly on the phone is indeed critically important. Expecting it to be possible at all times and with zero background noise isn't, and nobody expects this from his/her phone. Nor am I sure what your Starbucks example is indicative of. All it tells us is that iPhone 7 has worse noise cancellation than iPhone 5s, not that iPhone 5s cancels all noise at all times. The exi…

The iPhone 7(+) has better noise cancellation that the 5S, not the other way around. As noted in the original post, a 4th microphone was added to the 6S to assist with noise cancellation. There may have been improvements in the 7(+) over the 6S, but nobody has done the review to tell us, which is my point.

For some people being heard when there is background noise is not so important. For most, it is critically important for critically important calls which happen from time to time.

Re: The iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus Review: Iterating on a Flagship

#156

Post by pavelrub »

davidf18 wrote: post #155
pavelrub wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having the general ability to hear and be heard clearly on the phone is indeed critically important. Expecting it to be possible at all times and with zero background noise isn't, and nobody expects this from his/her phone. Nor am I sure what your Starbucks example is indicative of. All it tells us is that iPhone 7 has worse noise cancellation than iPhone 5s, not that iPhone 5s cancels all noise at all times. The exi…

The iPhone 7(+) has better noise cancellation that the 5S, not the other way around. As noted in the original post, a 4th microphone was added to the 6S to assist with noise cancellation. There may have been improvements in the 7(+) over the 6S, but nobody has done the review to tell us, which is my point. For some people being heard when there is background noise is not so important. For most, it is critically impor…

Sorry about the 7 - 5S confusion. However you still haven't provided any arguments for why the difference in noise cancellation between 5S and 7 is "critically important". The scenario where it is "critically important" is so contrived that we might as well call everything "critically important", including the color of the iPhone. It's ok to say that noise cancellation is a nice feature to have, but calling it "critically important" is a huge exaggeration.

Re: The iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus Review: Iterating on a Flagship

#157

Post by dkonofalski »

NetStrikeForce wrote: post #110
NetStrikeForce wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yet some think that's the most important part… Steve Jobs definitely didn't play down that part, to the point of being as important as any other part.

Ok, I usually don't do this, but it would be good to understand why I'm being downvoted here. Therefore it makes sense to talk about design and not downplay its importance with a comment like "Yet some think that's the most important part..."; because one of those "some" was Steve Jobs and I don't think Apple has changed its policy much in that regard. I'm not judging if he would have released this iPhone 7 or not, I…

I think the reason you were getting eaten alive was because your comment somehow confused the design being similar with that somehow being bad. Steve Jobs was always about refining and, when he found a design he liked, he stuck with it. For nearly the entire iPhone's existence, Jony Ive has been the one that has decided the design of the phone. I would imagine that if he's happy with it, Steve would have been too.

You're totally right with your comment but I think that the context of the other posts made it seem like you were suggesting something you weren't.

Re: The iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus Review: Iterating on a Flagship

#158

Post by schwarze_pest »

madeofpalk wrote: post #153
schwarze_pest wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think Google is finally recognizing this, and attempting to replicate it with the Pixel. They are still not there with Pixel. As long as they don't have their own SoC, there won't be proper long time support for their phones.

I don't buy this. Apple didn't always have their own SoC, and support didn't miraculously get better with the iPhone 4 when they introduced it.

Apple has complete control over their OS. They can keep their kernel interfaces stable if they want.

Google can't do this with their current development model. They are not in charge of the Linux kernel interfaces. Let's say it's 2019, Android Quaker Oats is here and Google would like to bring it to the Pixel. Quaker Oats is based on Linux 5.0. Qualcomm develops their drivers out of tree and the latest kernel that gets support for the Snapdragon 821 is Linux 4.69. Well, tough luck, Google and Pixel owners, Peanut Butter Jelly Sandwich is all you get.

Re: The iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus Review: Iterating on a Flagship

#159

Post by NetStrikeForce »

dkonofalski wrote: post #157
NetStrikeForce wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, I usually don't do this, but it would be good to understand why I'm being downvoted here. Therefore it makes sense to talk about design and not downplay its importance with a comment like "Yet some think that's the most important part..."; because one of those "some" was Steve Jobs and I don't think Apple has changed its policy much in that regard. I'm not judging if he would have released this iPhone 7 or not, I…

I think the reason you were getting eaten alive was because your comment somehow confused the design being similar with that somehow being bad. Steve Jobs was always about refining and, when he found a design he liked, he stuck with it. For nearly the entire iPhone's existence, Jony Ive has been the one that has decided the design of the phone. I would imagine that if he's happy with it, Steve would have been too. Yo…

Got it. I can see where the confusion comes from.

Thank you for your comment :-)

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