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6 Words: 'My Name Is Jamaal I'm White'

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Re: 6 Words: 'My Name Is Jamaal I'm White'

#141

Post by carussell »

shabda wrote: post #78
contergan wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Are Emily and Greg More Employable than Lakisha and Jamal? That's impossible to say on an individual level, but it is very likely. If you phrase the question differently, there's a pretty clear answer: >On average, are two white people more employable than two black people? Without knowing any further info about the possible candidates - Yes. Looking at education statistics in the US, it becomes clear pretty quickly…

> On average, are two white people more employable than two black people? Instead of above, the question you need to ask is "On average, are two white people who are applying to your job more employable than two black people who are applying to your job ? I don't believe the answer is yes. A person who has overcome the statistics you quote has the same ability and employability regardless of race.

> Instead of above, the question you need to ask is [...]

Yes, excellent point. (And we can go further still.)

I've been calling this the "fallacy of ignored instantiation". Personally, this is something I've been ruminating on for a while and have meant to do a writeup on it for a couple years now. Hopefully, though, that name is descriptive enough that a certain crowd would, upon hearing it alone, understand almost exactly where I would go with it.

(Alternatively, if anyone knows of any good treatments that already exist on this topic, please let me know.)

Re: 6 Words: 'My Name Is Jamaal I'm White'

#142

Post by icebraining »

[deleted] wrote: post #128
icebraining wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you ask every single person you meet if they speak the local language? That must get tiring. Or do you generalize and assume that people in a certain country by and large speak that country's language?

[deleted]

I think you're conflating generalizing with discriminating.

If you speak a certain English based on a guess informed by unrelated characteristics, you are generalizing. You created a group in your mind of people who have certain characteristics and speak a certain English, and put the person there.

Re: 6 Words: 'My Name Is Jamaal I'm White'

#143

Post by jimbobimbo »

That ringed a few bells...

Being an immigrant with both first and last names that people in US have hard time to pronounce let alone spell, I'd never turn the trick "My parents decided they wanted less traditional names for their children" on my children. In fact, I'm seriously thinking of legally changing my own name to look more American, because I'm tired of triple-checking my name spelling on each document and credit card, and responding to calls from people who cannot pronounce my name at all.

Re: 6 Words: 'My Name Is Jamaal I'm White'

#144

Post by numeromancer »

[deleted] wrote: post #98
numeromancer wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, quick: see me as an individual. You have 5 seconds. Note: Don't draw any conclusions about me that are based only on what little you know about me. You cannot, eg, draw conclusions upon that fact that I have an account on Hacker News. You must see me as an individual .

[deleted]

Better stay on the backroads when you drive. And don't try crossing the street without help from a grown-up.

Re: 6 Words: 'My Name Is Jamaal I'm White'

#145

Post by yummyfajitas »

happyscrappy wrote: post #30

Silicon Valley is a ridiculous festering pool of hypocrisy. Instead of trying to train and hire underprivileged blacks from right next door, Oakland, they fly or outsource them from half way around the world in India. Yet they think they are liberal and caring because they upvote stories like this.

Why should highly privileged blacks be favored over underprivileged Indians?

http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/01/31/the-haves-and-t...

(Note: privileges the black Oaklandians were born with include the right to work in the US, a highly functional education system where teachers show up to work, 24/7 running water and power, etc.)

Re: 6 Words: 'My Name Is Jamaal I'm White'

#146

Post by [deleted] »

icebraining wrote: post #142
[deleted] wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[deleted]

I think you're conflating generalizing with discriminating. If you speak a certain English based on a guess informed by unrelated characteristics, you are generalizing. You created a group in your mind of people who have certain characteristics and speak a certain English, and put the person there.

[deleted]

Re: 6 Words: 'My Name Is Jamaal I'm White'

#147

Post by feybay »

amyjess wrote: post #31
kingmanaz wrote: post #26

If one's going to play the ethnic etymology game, why not start with the NPR staff's overwhelmingly Jewish surnames? Why is every chance for black/white/hispanic/asian/male-female grievance mined and exploited by NPR, but their own ethnic nepotism swept under the carpet? Why don't NPR's Jews judge themselves by their own standards?

It's really sad that somebody would come to HN just to push an antisemitic agenda.

How is this "antisemitic"? Jewish people are disproportionately represented on NPR's staff. I don't see this as a problem, but talk about a speck in your brother's eye when you've removed the plank in yours. Live by the sword, die by the sword.

Re: 6 Words: 'My Name Is Jamaal I'm White'

#148

Post by feybay »

maxerickson wrote: post #106
laichzeit0 wrote: post #72

"In a high school soccer game I was called 'a white man with a [horrific racial expletive deleted] name.'" Horrific racial expletive. That seems a bit... excessive? Let's elevate the horrificness of this word to the point where if someone utters it they get fined or jailed. That should teach 'em. People are so ultra-politically correct these days I'm too scared to open my mouth for fear of offending someone, saying s…

The placeholder was chosen in the context of a relatively personal, informal group blog: http://thepoetryquestion.com/about/ If you think your sexist, racist, white male privileged, fat shaming thoughts are important to voice, I don't see why you would worry about them offending someone. The motions of political correctness can go too far, but the basic thought, to consider what words might mean to someone else, is a…

The fact that somebody can't write nigger destroys the flow of the article and wrongfully elevates the word. It's just a word, stop giving it power.

Re: 6 Words: 'My Name Is Jamaal I'm White'

#149

Post by vfa33 »

foldr wrote: post #117
beachstartup wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In other words, if you're actually black, then you can't escape racism just by changing your name. no shit sherlock. but changing your name to a neutral sounding one, no matter what your race, will get you in the door at a much higher rate, where you are actually able to present yourself and your abilities instead of having your resume, application, submission, or email summarily tossed in the trash for no reason o…

Changing your name might help, though it's sad that anyone should have to do this. I was replying because you (a) seemed to be missing the OP's point and (b) were coming close to blaming victims of racial discrimination for not changing their names.

It's absolutely victim blaming, not just coming close to it.

Of all the backwards and ridiculous comments I've seen on race-related threads here, that one is really exceptionally stupid.

Re: 6 Words: 'My Name Is Jamaal I'm White'

#150

Post by jdmichal »

chengiz wrote: post #25

So the school wanted diversity so they called him for an interview, but they hired him even though he was white. Yeah I don't buy that.

Maybe he didn't interview in person? Not everyone feels the need to physically meet someone before hiring them. What does it really say about us, that we so deeply feel the need to see someone before hiring them? It's not like their credentials change with visual contact.
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