Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Meditation study shows changes associated with awareness, stress (2011)

news.harvard.edu

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

141–150 of 185 posts

Re: Meditation study shows changes associated with awareness, stress (2011)

#141

Post by westoncb »

CWIZO wrote: post #53

Does anyone have any experience with meditation and RSI? I've been having RSI(like) problems for almost 3 years now. Recently I've read the Mindbody Prescription book[0] after finding this HN thread[1]. I must say it did help somewhat but I think I'm still in the process of healing myself. The bit I'm struggling is uncovering suppressed feelings and emotions. So I'm wondering wether meditation would help here. Any th…

I've also been treating RSI in the framework of Mindbody Prescription. I'm still just starting with meditation, but it seems like the main skill it teaches (this post describes it well: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8670184) is precisely what's good for getting over the RSI(like) problem: the main thing is to understand the 'sensations' aren't something that you need to deal with when they arise, it's okay if they arise—just let them pass. I'd gotten into a way of thinking that if the sensations were there it meant things were going poorly, if not they were going well; while what seems better is, things are okay either way. You don't want to stop the sensations, you want to understand they aren't harmful. I've done a decent survey of meditation literature, and I think a good overview from a number of perspectives would be this one: http://www.amazon.com/Beginners-Guide-Meditation-Inspiration...

Also, I thought this book was better than any of Sarno's for TMS stuff http://www.amazon.com/Rapid-Recovery-Back-Neck-Pain-ebook/dp...

Lemme know if you have other questions or anything.

Re: Meditation study shows changes associated with awareness, stress (2011)

#142

Post by insickness »

danielharan wrote: post #125
insickness wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the control group were doing nothing for eight weeks, they would expect no change. An expectation of change can illicit substantial differences. That's the placebo effect. When administering medication and checking for results, the control group is given a sugar pill rather than nothing. If they were given nothing it would not eliminate the placebo effect.

(You mean elicit, not illicit) Placebo might be a fair critique if we were talking about people's self-reported stress or well-being. Here we're talking about physical changes in the amygdala .

The brain and nervous system changes based on it's use and function. Look up neoroplasticity. This is nothing new. A placebo could certainly elicit a change within 8 weeks if participants thought it was helping them cope with stress. If you think dancing clockwise in a circle for ten minutes a day will help you, it probably will. That doesn't mean there is anything useful in the practice.

Re: Meditation study shows changes associated with awareness, stress (2011)

#143

Post by insickness »

danielharan wrote: post #125
insickness wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the control group were doing nothing for eight weeks, they would expect no change. An expectation of change can illicit substantial differences. That's the placebo effect. When administering medication and checking for results, the control group is given a sugar pill rather than nothing. If they were given nothing it would not eliminate the placebo effect.

(You mean elicit, not illicit) Placebo might be a fair critique if we were talking about people's self-reported stress or well-being. Here we're talking about physical changes in the amygdala .

The brain and nervous system changes based on it's use and function. Look up neoroplasticity. This is nothing new. A placebo could certainly elicit a change within 8 weeks if participants thought it was helping them cope with stress. If you think dancing clockwise in a circle for ten minutes a day will help you, it probably will. That doesn't mean there is anything useful in the practice.

Re: Meditation study shows changes associated with awareness, stress (2011)

#144

Post by maroonblazer »

DenisM wrote: post #122
jherdman wrote: post #85

I've been using the Headspace app ( https://www.headspace.com/ ) for a few months now and LOVE it. I highly recommend giving it a try. They have a free introductory course you can try too.

What does it do, and how does that help you?

For one, it gives you 10, 10-minute meditations for free, so you get a sense of what the whole enterprise is about without laying down any cash. For some (many?), that's all you need to get going.

Second, having listened to quite a few guided meditations, I find the Headspace guy (I think his name is Andy) to be one of the best. The meditations strike a near-perfect balance of helping direct my energy and attention in a way that doesn't draw attention to himself or his voice/delivery. i.e. he gives excellent guidance and gets out of the way.

Re: Meditation study shows changes associated with awareness, stress (2011)

#145

Post by scrapcode »

radva42 wrote: post #94
scrapcode wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment is great because I understand it. I've read up on meditation a little here, a little there. It was difficult for me to understand at first. What is meditation? What is the point? What happens when I do it right? When can I tell I'm doing it right? I just completely didn't understand it, and I couldn't find an explanation in any of the books that I read. I was making it out to be very complex. Then I actu…

Well, I wouldn't say that I can control it better. These reactions are way too primitive to be consciously controlled. I simply do not get triggered by the same situations any more ... maybe the mind becomes more resilient and thus the "grounded" and "calm" feelings. There are some pretty good explanations about how mindfulness actually works and how it causes the amygdala (the brain region responsible for emotional…

Thanks for responding. That makes sense. Very interesting stuff!

Re: Meditation study shows changes associated with awareness, stress (2011)

#146

Post by krick »

ArtDev wrote: post #132
krick wrote: post #11

I surfed through the links quite rapidly, but I haven't seen any description on what exactly exercises they used. "Meditation" is a term so easily abused, you know. There's quite a few schools calling "meditation" something completely different, some techniques almost opposites (quite literally) of each other. Hell, why to talk about different schools when even Zen has both very different zazen and other meditation p…

Look for Vipassana or Mindfulness meditation. Perfect for Atheists! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vipassan%C4%81

I thought "atheist" is an insult, huh… But whatever, it doesn't have anything to do with a topic. Question was about what participants were told to do in this particular study, and other people already pointed it out. And it's not Vipassana.

Re: Meditation study shows changes associated with awareness, stress (2011)

#147

Post by colechristensen »

wpietri wrote: post #112
kamakazizuru wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't see why this should be the case. I got into MM through a similar Vipassana Course and there couldn't have been a better start for me. Only meditating in this style for 10 days did a few things for me that 20-30 minutes a day would not have helped with : 1 - It helped me understand the power of this sort of meditation 2 - It REALLY motivated me to keep at it ever after I left 3 - I got to learn how to meditate p…

It's basically the same reason people shouldn't sign up for marathons as their first race: most people aren't prepared. That it worked for you is great, but you shouldn't mistake your experience for the general case. I have a lot of friends who do retreats like this, and they universally recommend that most people work their way up. Regarding point #3, for those who would like guidance, I recommend finding a local me…

It might be better to recommend a 1,2, or 3 day retreat which are also common and more approachable (and possible) to many people.

Re: Meditation study shows changes associated with awareness, stress (2011)

#149

Post by louwrentius »

I see a lot of anekdotes here on HN about meditation. But anekdotes are not science. I dislike the very close relation between meditation and spirituality that turns into fluffy bullshit.

I distrust peoples self-reporting because it is extremely unreliable.

The 'eight weeks to a better brain' sounds like any link-bait you see on the internet (' 6-pack in 12 days!').

Also, the results may be merely from the fact that these people spent ~30 minutes a day deliberately relaxing. What would happen if the control group would just lie on a couch for 30 minutes, doing nothing? None of that in the article.

Re: Meditation study shows changes associated with awareness, stress (2011)

#150

Post by aragot »

louwrentius wrote: post #149

I see a lot of anekdotes here on HN about meditation. But anekdotes are not science. I dislike the very close relation between meditation and spirituality that turns into fluffy bullshit. I distrust peoples self-reporting because it is extremely unreliable. The 'eight weeks to a better brain' sounds like any link-bait you see on the internet (' 6-pack in 12 days!'). Also, the results may be merely from the fact that…

Or that the group learnt a new skill, which involves both new physical and mental agility. For example would learning to dance for an introverted person produce the same changes in the brain?
Post reply on HN