We Have No Idea If Online Ads Work • Hacker News Board

Re: We Have No Idea If Online Ads Work

#141

Post by corin_ » Mon, Jun 23, 2014, 9:57 AM UTC

nl wrote: post #73

unclebucknasty wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it's not being done purposely for reasons others have mentioned, then I wonder if it comes down to the company's integration with Google. Presumably, Google wouldn't know if a sale took place unless the merchant somehow notified them. I'm guessing this might be with a pixel, script, or similar on their order confirmation page. So, if the merchant failed to implement this, Google would never know to stop showing th…

No, the merchant stops bidding for the as once you complete the purchase.

Generally speaking, no. The cookie pools of users to retarget will be stored not by the merchant but a third party (either the company serving the ads, or a middle man). When a user gets tagged they'll stay in the pool of people to re-target either until their expiration date is hit, or until they are removed. So the merchant would have to notify (automatically) that a user should be removed, not just chose to stop bidding on that user.

Re: We Have No Idea If Online Ads Work

#142

Post by wz1000 » Mon, Jun 23, 2014, 9:59 AM UTC

This is a classical example of a Prisoner's Dilemma [0] The conclusions drawn by the author don't seem to consider the fact that if Ebay doesn't buy ads next to it's own name, Amazon would. As with a Prisoner's Dilemma situation, if all parties(In this case companies with substantial recognition and brand loyalty) stop buying ads, they would stand to make the maximum profit. However, this opens them up to the possibility of losing clicks to a 'cheating' competitor, thus driving them into essentially an 'ad war'. [0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisoner's_dilemma#In_economics

Re: We Have No Idea If Online Ads Work

#143

Post by petercooper » Mon, Jun 23, 2014, 10:02 AM UTC

jebblue wrote: post #39

I read some of the comments and decided to go read the article, click the link, up pops a massive ad window for Slate. :-)

Well, sort of. It's funny because it really proves the headline right. Slate are trying to get you to sign up for their subscription package because I guess the ads aren't entirely cutting the mustard money-wise ;-)

Re: We Have No Idea If Online Ads Work

#144

Post by johnsteve » Mon, Jun 23, 2014, 10:11 AM UTC

Why cannot they? Online ads usually work and they benefit the company as well as the individual users in the long run as well as the short run Ever heard of Google AdSense? That is the most common way to make the online ads work

Re: We Have No Idea If Online Ads Work

#145

Post by vacri » Mon, Jun 23, 2014, 11:16 AM UTC

x0x0 wrote: post #91

hga wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One big issue for me is that brands have become drastically less useful in predicting product quality. Very few of the major brands that were big when I grew up in the '70s haven't thrown away their quality in favor of ... I'm not sure. Sony is a good example, even good through the '80s as well, as long as you didn't get something manufactured in Mexico with cold soldier joints, as my family back in SW Missouri did,…

I think people underrate how much this benefits apple. While I'm sure there are people with different experiences, apple in general, and in my experience, don't sell shit products and stand behind what they sell. With a full motherboard changeout available at a local apple store if necessary. Contrast to hp: we had a hp laptop w/ a next business day in-home warranty that nonetheless spent a week or more in hp's repai…

Contrast to hp: we had a hp laptop w/ a next business day in-home warranty that nonetheless spent a week or more in hp's repair shops on two occasions.

Back before flat screens were good, I remember our company would source big old CRTs from a brand with 'on-site replacement'. Turns out this actually meant "Did you keep the box and packaging? We'll pay for the shipping back to the repair depot". Um, no, because the boxes are huge and so is the polystyrene foam packaging. "Sorry, warranty doesn't apply to you". Sorry, last time we buy your big monitors.

Similarly, the Toshiba customer support centre wouldn't talk to you unless you paid them $55 first. Uh... I just want ask about buying some technical manuals. Nope, $55 to talk.

Re: We Have No Idea If Online Ads Work

#146

Post by tauslu » Mon, Jun 23, 2014, 11:36 AM UTC

Since Google does not have vast majority (more than 90%) market share in the US and it is possible to do geo-location based advertising (location based on IP information is largely accurate), they were able to test it out. Well, this shows that being a monopoly helps a lot with monetization when there are few technical possibilities to test . The slate article puts it very nicely. "Art was far more profitable than science."

Re: We Have No Idea If Online Ads Work

#147

Post by tragomaskhalos » Mon, Jun 23, 2014, 11:39 AM UTC

How sophisticated is click-tracking these days? Is a click on an advertising link always billed, or are there other qualifying criteria in play? I ask because the only time I ever click on an ad link is by mistake (typically when Safari is busy jiggling about with the page layout so that my finger hits the wrong target), and wonder if this is actually costing the company concerned.

Re: We Have No Idea If Online Ads Work

#148

Post by 1stop » Mon, Jun 23, 2014, 12:04 PM UTC

hackuser wrote: post #76

1stop wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah we do: Coca-cola <-- The product offers no value other than "brand". (Brand is advertising).

> Yeah we do: Coca-cola It tastes good. How is it different than any other form of pleasure that is sold, such as (non-artistic) video games, alcohol, any luxury good, fashion, etc. EDIT: ... or World Cup soccer, on my TV now.

No one would ever wake up and go: "I need/want coke" (without advertising).

Re: We Have No Idea If Online Ads Work

#149

Post by tauslu » Mon, Jun 23, 2014, 12:20 PM UTC

How does one know that a keyword is a brand or not? If the click through rate is above 30% (people really searched for the term) and there is some normal conversion after clicking (meaning that people really search for the relevant keyword, they do not mistake it with something else), then the keyword is a brand.

Re: We Have No Idea If Online Ads Work

#150

Post by Amezarak » Mon, Jun 23, 2014, 12:56 PM UTC

dingaling wrote: post #134

mdpane wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For most of the iPod's lifespan it was not the best product on the market, it was just the best marketed. I wouldn't say it was just better marketed, although that is true. It was also better designed, both in its hardware and software. An iPod in your hands felt and looked great and the scroll wheel made it intuitive to use. Anyone could easily pick it up and check out what you had in your library. Before I had one,…

> and the scroll wheel made it intuitive to use. It was only 'intuitive' if someone showed you how to use it, which means... it wasn't intuitive. They dropped that interface element quickly enough.

I too have never understood how the scroll wheel could be considered intuitive. The first time I saw one I was somewhat baffled until my friend showed it to me and even then it was always a struggle to control.

Intuitive (to me) would be the scrolling on other players...hit up it goes up one, hold up and it goes up increasingly fast. Maybe that's boring but it's completely obvious how to work it when you pick it up.