Engineers Allege Hiring Collusion in Silicon Valley • Hacker News Board

Re: Engineers Allege Hiring Collusion in Silicon Valley

#141

Post by smsm42 » Mon, Mar 03, 2014, 7:00 PM UTC

mgstr wrote: post #107

smsm42 wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd say definitely lower than RN. Not to mention all kinds of certifications that can be expensive and time-consuming too. Great software engineers are rare, but common ones are nowhere near the level you need to be to make a significant contribution to math field. And the pay is much better.

Most of the developers I've met from the companies mentioned have masters or phds as well as substantial work experience on real-world projects. Those that don't are usually exceptional individuals.

You have very biased view of the industry then, probably because of the specifics of your social circle. Absolute majority of tech industry doesn't have PhDs and does work that in no way, form or manner requires PhD.

Re: Engineers Allege Hiring Collusion in Silicon Valley

#142

Post by sliverstorm » Mon, Mar 03, 2014, 7:22 PM UTC

smsm42 wrote: post #139

sliverstorm wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem isn't when one company pays better than everybody else. The problem is when the top ten different companies, all of which you would like to work for and all of which pay the best, agree with eachother that none of them will pay you what you are worth. Now, I think you already understand that, and your counter was "well then someone will hop in and pay you what you are worth and they will suffer for collud…

It doesn't matter if it's one company or 10 companies out of 1000. The claim is most companies - overwhelming majority, as it appears - can't pay you this money. Still you think you're worth more than any other company except 10 can afford to pay, and despite being paid obviously in the highest in the industry, you think you're worth much more. That's OK, overwhelming majority of people think they are way above avera…

you think that any effort for the companies to pay you less than your imagined self-worth is illegal

Good lord, not any effort, just efforts that are, in fact, illegal. Your argument seems to be based on,

"Well these people already get paid a lot, so I don't really see why they should get paid more, even if their wages are being illegally depressed"

you still think they owe you more and need to be coerced to pay you more

The suit is not to "coerce" the companies to pay them more, it's seeking damages for the companies allegedly doing something illegal to pay them less.

Re: Engineers Allege Hiring Collusion in Silicon Valley

#143

Post by dlitz » Tue, Mar 04, 2014, 6:46 AM UTC

raverbashing wrote: post #33

suprgeek wrote: post #8

I have personally witnessed the frustrating side of this "no poaching" pact. A close friend was tired of the "Manager Arrogance" at one of these colluding companies. He quietly put out the word,pretty quickly got approached by a hiring manager at another company - things were going swimmingly. Then the Hiring manager put in the Req to HR - a V.P. called him personally and but confirmed this "no poaching" B.S. The wag…

What about quitting first after knowing of this fact?

That's sometimes hard to do. For example, if you're here on an H-1B visa.

Re: Engineers Allege Hiring Collusion in Silicon Valley

#144

Post by smsm42 » Wed, Mar 05, 2014, 1:39 AM UTC

sliverstorm wrote: post #142

smsm42 wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't matter if it's one company or 10 companies out of 1000. The claim is most companies - overwhelming majority, as it appears - can't pay you this money. Still you think you're worth more than any other company except 10 can afford to pay, and despite being paid obviously in the highest in the industry, you think you're worth much more. That's OK, overwhelming majority of people think they are way above avera…

you think that any effort for the companies to pay you less than your imagined self-worth is illegal Good lord, not any effort, just efforts that are, in fact, illegal. Your argument seems to be based on, "Well these people already get paid a lot, so I don't really see why they should get paid more, even if their wages are being illegally depressed" you still think they owe you more and need to be coerced to pay you…

So basically you only argument why it is bad is "because it's illegal". There are lots of things that are or were illegal just because it serves some particular special interest or just because some lawmakers are doing really stupid things (I could spend half an hour here naming them but I'm sure a list not shorter than mine just popped into your head). So the most you can claim that special interest you're aligned with has upper hand in this particular case. Somehow, again, it doesn't add to my sympathy - there are already too many people that are extracting money primarily by lawmaking and lobbying, joining them is not exactly the best thing for the industry. So far no cogent argument of why these people need special protection of their interests has been presented, and the only argument presented - "we can win in court" - smells pretty bad in my opinion.

>>> it's seeking damages for the companies allegedly doing something illegal to pay them less.

Same thing. They couldn't extract money (in addition to huge money they did extract) by voluntary negotiation, so they extract it by coercion. When it is being done is a technical detail.