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AI singer now occupies eleven spots on iTunes singles chart

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Re: AI singer now occupies eleven spots on iTunes singles chart

#141

I find the production and consumption of AI music to be uniquely... anti-human. You can make utilitarian arguments for most other uses of AI. For example, the code you're generating didn't exist before, and it would take serious time or money to write it. So, I get it, the economic argument is compelling enough. But music? There's basically an inexhaustible supply of human-created tracks that can be accessed for next…

Is formulaic pop music produced by a corporate label that's designed to push all the right buttons more "human" than the average track you find published on Suno? I wouldn't say so. Pop music was already to some extent a commodity.

> Pop music was already to some extent a commodity.

The commodification of humanity predates human history. It may be a negative trend that alienates us from each other and from the products of our labor, but it is truly ancient.

Re: AI singer now occupies eleven spots on iTunes singles chart

#142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you consider say elevator music - music that's just there to fill space, rather than to be listened too - then I don't think there's that much difference between using AI to produce it and using AI to produce clip art or boilerplate code.

Music as wallpaper vs music as artistic paintings. We are fine with mass-producing wallpaper with machines. People buy this every day, no problem. We are not fine with mass-producing framed paintings that are "art". Both hang on the wall as decoration. Essentially the same purpose. But we have very different feelings about them and hold them to very different standards. Music is the same. We have muzak - background m…

> We are not fine with mass-producing framed paintings that are "art".

Uhh... Cheap, basically AI generated art for home decor definitely exists.

> And then we have music that is art and is supposed to be listened to explicitly

Just like how most people are not sommeliers, most people just listen to pop music "slop"

Re: AI singer now occupies eleven spots on iTunes singles chart

#143
post #95

I wonder how well it would work to use AI as a front end to Band-in-a-Box? Band-in-a-Box is a commercial program that has been around since 1990. What it did then was let you specify a chord progression, style, tempo, and instruments and it would make a generate a MIDI track. I think it might have also been able to take a melody and come up with a chord progression for it in a style/genre of your choosing. The target…

BIAB is still best in class (even if the UI is practically Soviet era) simply because of the sheer number of RealTracks, which are actual performances by musicians that dynamically adapt to your chord progression.

I’ve actually taken some of my own compositions and run them through Suno using the “Cover” option, and it’s pretty nuts what it can do.

What would be really cool is the concept of combining a physical arranger keyboard (like a Yamaha PSR-SX) with real-time orchestration produced by a backing generative model.

https://mordenstar.com/blog/dutyfree-shop

Re: AI singer now occupies eleven spots on iTunes singles chart

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As far as I'm concerned we're content scarce and I don't care what makes the music - humans, robots, netherworld demons - I just want good music. Presumably you've already listened to every piece of music ever recorded? Otherwise it seems it would be more efficient to do that first than wait for AI to generate it and you chancing upon it.

[flagged]

Oh that's what you're banging on about. You think AI is like a demon, or you think LLMs are people too, something like that, hence "I don't care what makes the music". That would otherwise be a spooky and implausible phrase that says something strange about what gives music quality, as if quality in music is something ethereal and mathematical and objective and detached from the human condition, and detached from artists. But if you think the AI counts as a person too then it seems less cold and abstract.

Re: AI singer now occupies eleven spots on iTunes singles chart

#145

I find the production and consumption of AI music to be uniquely... anti-human. You can make utilitarian arguments for most other uses of AI. For example, the code you're generating didn't exist before, and it would take serious time or money to write it. So, I get it, the economic argument is compelling enough. But music? There's basically an inexhaustible supply of human-created tracks that can be accessed for next…

It isn’t indifference, it’s obliviousness. My mother keeps on listening to AI music, and I’ll be like “why are you listening to this slop” and she’ll then argue back that it isn’t AI, it’s actually really very good and I’m just jealous, as the synthetic voice continues to warble nonsenses like a fucking arcade machine full of snakes in the background.

It’s an even more uncomfortable truth: your average Joe cannot tell the difference between human made music or AI generations, just as they also really think that that 8 year old African boy with a huge beard and no hands built a helicopter out of old bottles, or that that cat walked into a hairdresser wearing a suit and had its whiskers curled.

So there’s no argument for it apart from “people will buy the product because they can’t tell that it isn’t real”.

Re: AI singer now occupies eleven spots on iTunes singles chart

#146

I have no doubt that those numbers have been inflated by AI powered marketing tools, dead internet theory style.

Deezer had an analysis where they found almost all the listeners for AI music was fraud bots.

Link: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/jun/18/up-to-70-...

Up to 70% of streams of AI music on Deezer were fraudulent!

Re: AI singer now occupies eleven spots on iTunes singles chart

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and partly due to resistance from creatives My favorite example of resistance from creatives was the space shuttle landing gear button. The space shuttle orbiter was technically capable of performing an automated mission, with the exception of opening the landing gear doors. This was ostensibly so that there would be no risk of the heat shield being compromised, as the landing gear doors were in the heat shield. Bu…

Red herring. The Puritan work ethic that seems to always resolve to "human value=human income" (regardless of the ethic's stated intentions) is what causes this, not creatives in and of themselves.

I get that there is a strong online movement to destroy the traditional American Dream value of "work hard, and become rich" but that does not apply in fields where money is not the motivator. No single astronaut has ever expressed financial gain as a motivator for moving into that profession.

Quite the opposite, many have given up fortunes and prosperous businesses to move into spaceflight.

Re: AI singer now occupies eleven spots on iTunes singles chart

#149
I see many people claiming AI art has no value.

I could understand opposing it on an ethical basis. I could even understand it if they claimed that it will dull us out or it just isn't good for the brain, sort of like we can say that tiktok/instagram reels are probably not good for our brains.

But to claim that it has no value? Surely my definition of value is just different, and I'm playing semantics.

The least-funny of clowns has value if they make someone laugh.

The most mind-destroying tiktok/reels have value if they entertain someone for a little while.

I'm not saying these are necessarily good things, but they certainly hold value. And AI art, like memes, like instagram reels, like watching paint dry, has value if consumers enjoy it. It has much more value than watching paint dry because many more people clearly enjoy it (and I don't think their brains will rot because of it).

Personally, I think AI art enables such a low barrier to entry that obviously we have a big problem with mass production of slop. Things that entertain (again, like tiktok/reels), but are probably not a net-positive for society.

However, while I recognize that problem, I know several people who are creating INCREDIBLE art with AI which they would never be able to do. Things that bring tears to my eyes and that are definitely not slop. Even if they are produced in a day, it takes a special mind to conjure up the right things to produce. Faster does not always mean worse (and what even is "good" or "bad" in art??). Tale as old as time.

There is an ethical debate to be had about this art being built on the stolen assets that previous artists, using traditional tools, created. I think it's a serious debate and I don't really know how we'll solve it.

So if I:

1. Ignore the ethical debate around attribution and, as an exercise, assume that there's "fair compensation to everyone involved" (not so sure if this will happen)

2. Assume we do find a system to properly curate content (which I do actually think will happen -- we will find ways of weeding out the best)

Then I absolutely want AI art to succeed. It has enabled so many around me to produce so many incredible things, I can't wait for more chapters in this beautiful history of humanity. Where more people can create more.

"1." is a tough ask. We need to figure it out. "2." I think we'll manage, and I guess even if we don't get "1.", then cat's out of the bag and these tools are too world-changing to keep them from being used. I want to see what these amazing creative geniuses do with them.

Re: AI singer now occupies eleven spots on iTunes singles chart

#150

I find the production and consumption of AI music to be uniquely... anti-human. You can make utilitarian arguments for most other uses of AI. For example, the code you're generating didn't exist before, and it would take serious time or money to write it. So, I get it, the economic argument is compelling enough. But music? There's basically an inexhaustible supply of human-created tracks that can be accessed for next…

> what's the argument for it Record companies can sell it and don't have to pay any royalties. They only pay the artists pennies as it is, but that's too much for them.

Electronic music exists but has limited commercial scope because most people don't see the point of music if they can't form an emotional connection with the artist through the music. Popular music has an intense focus on the artist.

AI "music" has the same issues as electronic music but worse: because it's trying to imitate humans rather than be its own thing like electronic music, it's not only emotionally unavailable but also creepy. Can you imagine listening to an AI "musician" laughing, for instance? It makes my skin crawl even thinking about it.

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