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Artemis II crew see first glimpse of far side of Moon [video]

bbc.com

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Re: Artemis II crew see first glimpse of far side of Moon [video]

#141

Post by dingaling »

bombcar wrote: post #99
ryandrake wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think OP's problem with it is that it's "political" but that it's a product of pork and corporate welfare. The political thrust of the Apollo program was more "beat the Russians" and less "funnel money into dozens of already-rich corporations in favored districts." Even thought there was a lot of that, too. Modern space (and defense) projects seem to be almost 100% "pork funnel" and zero anything else.

The pork funnel is going to exist unless something major changes; so I'd rather get moonshots out of the pork.

But how many Moonshots could we have got out of $100 billion of vegetarian non-pork?

Everything about SLS, and most of Artemis, has been dictated by Congress, often overriding expert advice.

Why not just give NASA the money and let them get on with it?

The same happens with the US military, Congress constantly deleting funding for programs they don't like to fund ones they do.

Re: Artemis II crew see first glimpse of far side of Moon [video]

#142

Post by bluegatty »

izzydata wrote: post #106
bluegatty wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

nah, it just seems like that on Twitter. We have more prosperity by far than we've ever had in history, this is a time to celebrate. We have our 'ducks in a row' more now than in the 1960's when we went to the moon because of a cold war and nuclear annihilation / escalation. My grandparents were born on farms with no electricity, plumbing, there was no real 'police' no social services, no healthcare, no antibiotics,…

It is a fine time to be going to the moon, but we could be doing multiple productive things at the same time. It just doesn't surprise me that there are so many people that are not caring so much about this.

We are doing multiple productive things. Zillions of them.

They are like 50 companies making robots right now that will soon do a lot of work.

There are advances in many fields.

Headlines are dominated by something else, the 'news' is not a good reflection of reality.

Re: Artemis II crew see first glimpse of far side of Moon [video]

#144

Post by [deleted] »

beacon294 wrote: post #134
dotancohen wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The author of this poem went to great lengths to show his racism. It reminds me of a post, probably on Reddit, of a similar racist nature. Just when it's going in the other direction it's clearer. The post was by a man, supposedly white, who had to pull his child or children from private school because he could not pay for it. His frustration was based on the fact that his taxes were higher than the school tuition, a…

He could be expressing the generational frustration of being black in America. When things are so segregated you feel you are looking across at a different country landing on the moon, you might write such a poem.

[deleted]

Re: Artemis II crew see first glimpse of far side of Moon [video]

#145

Post by pstuart »

juleiie wrote: post #122
nine_k wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In 2-3 years we should expect a Starship mission to Moon, at a much more sensible scale, as in the amount of scientific gear and actual researchers delivered to the surface (and then back).

There is literally not many things in life I hope so much for than starship success. Sounds strange perhaps but I just love space and I hope it succeeds. Funnily I absolutely despise Musk at the same time for being absolute buffoon

We're days away from the SpaceX IPO that will make Musk even richer than he is now. I don't trust him with that money.

Re: Artemis II crew see first glimpse of far side of Moon [video]

#146

Post by rantingdemon »

nine_k wrote: post #81
nixon_why69 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not being a hater, but we landed on the moon 55+ years ago and now we're doing a flyby with 35+ year-old engine tech. It's good that we're doing something but we should be doing better.

In 2-3 years we should expect a Starship mission to Moon, at a much more sensible scale, as in the amount of scientific gear and actual researchers delivered to the surface (and then back).

2 to 3 years is wildly optimistic. Of the 5 launches last year 3 were failures and it's not even close to be ready for humans yet.

Re: Artemis II crew see first glimpse of far side of Moon [video]

#147

Post by remarkEon »

rybosome wrote: post #33
b00ty4breakfast wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's amazing, but I'll refer you to Gil Scott-Heron for my feelings on the matter A rat done bit my sister Nell With whitey on the moon Her face and arms began to swell And whitey's on the moon I can't pay no doctor bills But whitey's on the moon Ten years from now I'll be payin' still While whitey's on the moon The man just upped my rent last night Cause whitey's on the moon No hot water, no toilets, no lights But w…

I just came across this poem a few days ago and had the opportunity to think about it. It’s a valuable perspective to hear. As someone prone to getting caught up in the breathless excitement about science, progress, human achievement, etc., it is a hard truth that these things are abstract and not relevant for people who are struggling with day-to-day life, particularly when those struggles are a result of the same g…

I don't think it's actually a useful perspective at all. The poem is racial resentment repackaged as a means to guilt trip people into feeling bad about adventure, science, and exploration. Unless they were pretty well read at a young age, most millennials probably first experienced this poem in the film First Man, where it is read as a backdrop to Apollo 11 traveling to the moon. It's a great scene because the juxtaposition is stark. We can either hold ourselves back an an endless and futile journey on solving the human condition of poverty and inequality, or we can explore the stars. It's an easy choice.

Re: Artemis II crew see first glimpse of far side of Moon [video]

#148

Post by philistine »

EvanAnderson wrote: post #102
GolfPopper wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking for myself (who has been fascinated with the space program since I was a small child), any joy I might feel around Artemis II feels tainted, by the immense amount of pork involved (SLS is called "Senate Launch System" for good reason) to the point where Artemis is more corporate welfare that happens to involve the Moon than a real space program, and by my belief that it is intended to be little more than a q…

I know the RS-25 engines[0] (aka SSME, Space Shuttle Main Engine) were "reusable" in an academic sense (needing a ton of refurbishment after each use) but it hurts my heart that we're dropping them in the ocean and it makes it hard for me to feel good about the Artemis program. It's irrational but it makes the kid who loved the Space Shuttle (which, itself, was a political pork barrel and a jack-of-all-trades-master-…

You and me both. They don’t even put a parachute on the boosters to get them back. Some pieces on these boosters have been in use since the 80s.

Re: Artemis II crew see first glimpse of far side of Moon [video]

#149

Post by rationalist »

elteto wrote: post #127
kelnos wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get the general frustration there, but it's weird to focus on NASA's budget when it's such a teeny tiny fraction of the total. Yes, there's a lot of government waste, but NASA ain't it. And I would suggest that the billionaire class and unfettered capitalism are far more responsible for the modern day version of Scott-Heron's woes than the good ol' government scapegoat.

If DOGE served for anything at all it was for showing that there isn’t even that much “waste” per se. If there’s any waste it’s in the Pentagon which can’t even audit itself, but of course DOGE didn’t even get close to that. It was all performative for them.

I think they proved that the waste is not easily defined. I would call fraud, waste, but a computer program isn't likely to discover it without boots on the ground looking to see if the money is actually going where the records indicate.

Re: Artemis II crew see first glimpse of far side of Moon [video]

#150

Post by [deleted] »

pstuart wrote: post #145
juleiie wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is literally not many things in life I hope so much for than starship success. Sounds strange perhaps but I just love space and I hope it succeeds. Funnily I absolutely despise Musk at the same time for being absolute buffoon

We're days away from the SpaceX IPO that will make Musk even richer than he is now. I don't trust him with that money.

[deleted]
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