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Terence Tao, at 8 years old (1984) [pdf]

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Re: Terence Tao, at 8 years old (1984) [pdf]

#141
post #130

I just read this yesterday in Conversations with Walter Murch, a well-known film editor. Not exactly the same, but I do get the sense that Tao still feels the same way about math: As I've gone through life, I've found that your chances for happiness are increased if you wind up doing something that is a reflection of what you loved most when you were somewhere between nine and eleven years old. Interviewer: Yes—somet…

> when you were somewhere between nine and eleven years old. As endearing as it sounds, that's pure selection bias on Walter's end rather than something even remotely common. Clearly there are cases of this sort, like arts and other creative tangents, but on average it's a result of a discovery process much later in life.

I think you completely missed the point of his anecdote. It’s not a scientific study, he is merely saying that at age 9-11, you’re old enough to have a decent understanding of what you’re interested in, but not old enough to start worrying about social and financial pressures and expectations.

And so the thing you were interested in at that age is probably similar to what you’ll be interested in now, if you remove social and financial expectations.

Re: Terence Tao, at 8 years old (1984) [pdf]

#143

Okay, so? Has any of this research been used for anything? Or is it all nerd snipe set theory nonsense?

Honestly a quick google would tell you what you want to know. But something tells me you must consider yourself an other worldly genius if you consider any part of set theory as nonsense.

Re: Terence Tao, at 8 years old (1984) [pdf]

#144
post #8

This brings to mind the childhood of John Stuart Mill: - Learned Greek starting age three. - Was studying Plato at age six. - Studied Latin starting at age eight. And more: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Stuart_Mill#Biography I guess it helps that he had Jeremy Bentham hanging around his house from an early age.

My daughter spoke four languages at age 3. Not because she is gifted, but because she grew up in an immigrant environment. One language with me, another with my partner who speaks a different mother tongue than I do, and the two local languages where we live. And this is utterly unremarkable where I live. When we visit my family (who are all monolingual), they think she is a prodigy. She’s not. She’s just a normal ki…

Learning by immersion is a completely different process from learning by being tutored, never mind learning by oneself from books.

Re: Terence Tao, at 8 years old (1984) [pdf]

#145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Latin and Greek are classical, 'dead' languages.

That there are no native speakers doesn't mean there are no tutors that speak it.

Learning by immersion is still a very different process from learning by being tutored. One is something that young childrens' brains do almost entirely subconsciously, the other is conscious academic work.

Re: Terence Tao, at 8 years old (1984) [pdf]

#146
post #8

This brings to mind the childhood of John Stuart Mill: - Learned Greek starting age three. - Was studying Plato at age six. - Studied Latin starting at age eight. And more: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Stuart_Mill#Biography I guess it helps that he had Jeremy Bentham hanging around his house from an early age.

I learned to read at age three or four, I think and I consumed every book I could find, including various math books, old chemistry books, etc. I didn't really understand anything there, but it was just fascinating to me to even touch that knowledge. So I'm a bit skeptic about these stories of children studying Plato.

Re: Terence Tao, at 8 years old (1984) [pdf]

#147

Okay, so? Has any of this research been used for anything? Or is it all nerd snipe set theory nonsense?

Honestly a quick google would tell you what you want to know. But something tells me you must consider yourself an other worldly genius if you consider any part of set theory as nonsense.

Well its not nonsense, and its very interesting, but its just a certain formulation of logic in the end, nothing more or less.

Re: Terence Tao, at 8 years old (1984) [pdf]

#148
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are many, many people (math majors, competitive programmers, chess players, etc) who devote incredible effort to becoming better, and simply cannot reach elite levels. And while in most cases elite players are also putting in a lot of effort, there are many cases where it is still relatively less than their peers who are trying harder but still lagging them. Would you ever be tempted to make such a claim (that…

> Would you ever be tempted to make such a claim (that everyone is close to the same in ability and effort is the main determiner of success) about athletes? Well yes, absolutely. People don’t do quadruple axels on the ice because they were somehow born with the ability, they can do it because they practice figure skating every day for years. Innate ability (or in this case, let’s be honest, mostly genetics determini…

That's probably why some competitions are called Math Olympics.

OTOH maybe there is no posibility whatsoever that genetics can determine mind shape no matter what.

Re: Terence Tao, at 8 years old (1984) [pdf]

#149
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't find the reference but from an interview with his parents there apparently there wasn't much "nurturing" other than simply making available the necessary materials which he gobbled up. Its not like they put a made him practice for an hour a day. A boy in my high school class made IMO and got a gold medal (and later on won the Putnam one year). They interviewed his parents and it was a similar story.

Agreed. It's been decades, but personally being acquaintances with IMO and IOI gold medalists made me rethink a lot of things. With our society being ostensibly meritocratic regarding intelligence, people generally don't like to listen to stories that suggest that nurture and hard work aren't as important as they presume.

Please elaborate

Re: Terence Tao, at 8 years old (1984) [pdf]

#150
post #149
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. It's been decades, but personally being acquaintances with IMO and IOI gold medalists made me rethink a lot of things. With our society being ostensibly meritocratic regarding intelligence, people generally don't like to listen to stories that suggest that nurture and hard work aren't as important as they presume.

Please elaborate

We pressure our kids into grit, but genius comes from the inside.

Be grateful when it happens, but be happy if it does not.

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