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EU mandates replaceable batteries by 2027 (2023)

environment.ec.europa.eu

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Re: EU mandates replaceable batteries by 2027 (2023)

#141

Post by wolvoleo »

athrowaway3z wrote: post #18
wolvoleo wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hate that kind of thing though when it would come to smaller batteries. This battery passport prevents the user from replacing their car battery themselves easily. Which is entirely in contradiction to this legislation's objective for smaller devices which aims at making self-service easier. But it also links devices to their battery meaning one can not be recycled apart from the other! It's already causing problem…

I have no clue what you're trying to say. The whole point is that people don't throw away their original device. Yours situation seems rather niche, and it sounds like you might be going out of 'business' while at the same time allowing 1000x times the number of people to want to do dummy-self-repairs (i.e. replace their batteries) even if it's with a bit more theater about who is licensed. The total number of people…

Like I said I don't have a business. I don't even do repairs for other people (unless for friends for free). Being accused of being a business was really annoying, I'm just a tinkerer so I have a lot of stuff I play with yes. I'm a member of a makerspace so used electronics are really nice.

I'm just worried they will start tracking individual components of devices too like they do with car batteries now and cause a lot of hassle if you do something that doesn't fit the standard flow. When it comes to EVs I don't give a shit because I hate cars, but once I can't repurpose other electronics anymore as I see fit, it will be a problem. I view this as a sneaky way of introducing a subscription model to electronics, like you don't really own the stuff you buy anymore. Like that evil WEF slogan: "You will own nothing and you will be happy".

Re: EU mandates replaceable batteries by 2027 (2023)

#142

Post by gruez »

tolerance wrote: post #137
peterfirefly wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So I am not wrong but you don't like it?

If I were to tell you that the examples you selected depict you as a bigot how would you react?

Freedom of speech is exactly for unpopular (or "bigot") opinions. You don't need freedom of speech to protect you from saying that puppies are cute.

Re: EU mandates replaceable batteries by 2027 (2023)

#143

Post by stefanfisk »

hermanzegerman wrote: post #87
mytailorisrich wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Re. mobile phones it is because it allows sleeker and thinner design, and IMHO it wasn't that common to replace batteries, anyway. But, really this is a non-issue because if you need a new battery for you phone, including iphone and samsung, just get it replaced. That's not super common to need it (again) but there is no issue having it done. I had it done before. So overall I am skeptical that it will make a differe…

Oh yeah, because paying Apple 120$ for a 30$ part is totally the same Vs just doing it on your own with no tools. Also, your phone must be in pristine condition because otherwise you will need to "repair" tons of stuff you don't need repaired/replaced.

You can just use a third party shop.

Re: EU mandates replaceable batteries by 2027 (2023)

#144

Post by Saline9515 »

MadxX79 wrote: post #73
varispeed wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The device can default to booting software signed by the manufacturer but the user should always be able to use a physical key to unlock the device and install his own keys and certificates instead. This part is not going to happen, because security services need their backdoors intact. If you supply user with keys, they might flash the device with more secure operating system rendering any surveillance effort frui…

If I worked in a European intelligence agency, and considering how the the official US security policy revolves around bringing about regime change in Europe in support of far right extremist parties, and how supportive the tech company leadership seems to be of those goals, I would probably think that locking that very real existential threat to their democracies out would be a worthwhile tradeoff.

European governments and security services have their own surveillance and control agendas, most of them already use Palantir to enforce them. It's not like there are any "good" guys against "bad" ones.

Re: EU mandates replaceable batteries by 2027 (2023)

#145

Post by stefanfisk »

sschueller wrote: post #118
243341286 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you make a phone with replaceable battery to also be water resistant?

It is doable and with all the amazing achievements this is the thing that is too hard to get working? Also all new foldables are not water proof (yet). Your MacBook isn't water proof either yet the battery is also permanently glued in. Why?

MacBook batteries have not been permanently glued in for quite some time. Replacement requires some disassembly but is perfectly doable for most techies.

https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/MacBook+Air+13-Inch+Late+2020+B...

Re: EU mandates replaceable batteries by 2027 (2023)

#146

Post by Someone »

hermanzegerman wrote: post #89
mytailorisrich wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly if people start to buy extra batteries as you suggest then this will completely defeat the stated purpose of having replaceable batteries! That being said, now they buy external power banks...

No it won't. It's about reducing eWaste from the devices itself. Throwing away a whole device just because the battery is bad is much worse than just throwing away a worn out battery. My 9 year old ThinkPad T470 is doing well with his 3rd or 4rd battery (and a new SSD and more RAM). Also external powerbanks are pretty unpractical compared to a fresh new internal battery.

> My 9 year old ThinkPad T470 is doing well with his 3rd or 4rd battery (and a new SSD and more RAM).

But would it be doing well with only a new battery? Chances are a regulation that only regulates batteries won’t do much for tech that still is improving at a fairly decent rate.

Re: EU mandates replaceable batteries by 2027 (2023)

#147

Post by Someone »

cyberrock wrote: post #26
mg wrote: post #10

I have been maintaining this chart of phones with replaceable batteries available in the USA for 10 years now: https://www.productchart.com/smartphones/removable_battery Man, is it empty these days. The chart used to be pretty full. Now it only has about 1% of all phones that are in the Product Chart database. As the other 99% have fixed batteries. I'm looking forward to see if the EU decision will push some companie…

The EU directive doesn't even compel them to have those kinds of removable batteries in the EU, because being removable with commercially available tools is considered compliant [0]. The topic has been too obfuscated with hype pieces. Still, it would be nice to not have to break glass and melt glue to open up phones. [0] https://repair.eu/news/making-batteries-removable-and-replac...

> The EU directive doesn't even compel them to have those kinds of removable batteries in the EU, because being removable with commercially available tools is considered compliant

This is a follow-up directive that goes further. https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL...:

“Any natural or legal person that places on the market products incorporating portable batteries shall ensure that those batteries are readily removable and replaceable by the end-user at any time during the lifetime of the product. That obligation shall only apply to entire batteries and not to individual cells or other parts included in such batteries.

A portable battery shall be considered readily removable by the end-user where it can be removed from a product with the use of commercially available tools, without requiring the use of specialised tools, unless provided free of charge with the product, proprietary tools, thermal energy, or solvents to disassemble the product.

Any natural or legal person that places on the market products incorporating portable batteries shall ensure that those products are accompanied with instructions and safety information on the use, removal and replacement of the batteries. Those instructions and that safety information shall be made available permanently online, on a publicly available website, in an easily understandable way for end-users.”

Re: EU mandates replaceable batteries by 2027 (2023)

#148

Post by vladvasiliu »

peterfirefly wrote: post #91
mentalgear wrote: post #13

The EU is displaying exactly the kind of political leadership we need in this topic: pro-consumer, pro-environment, and firmly against planned obsolescence. Removable batteries were the industry standard in the early days of mobile phones, and it worked perfectly. We only lost that standard when Apple’s 'walled garden' mindset infected the rest of the industry. The amount of avoidable e-waste generated since then is…

> Removable batteries were the industry standard in the early days of mobile phones, and it worked perfectly. Phones back then were bad (so accommodating replaceable batteries was easy), and batteries degraded quickly (so it was a necessity). Modern phones are smaller, need to be more water proof, stuffed to an unimaginable degree with components -- and modern batteries last a really long time. I am not so sure it's…

>Modern phones are smaller, need to be more water proof, stuffed to an unimaginable degree with components -- and modern batteries last a really long time.

This argument always comes up when talking about replaceable smartphone batteries and headphone jacks. But Samsung had waterproof phones before Apple, and they still had replaceable batteries and, gasp a headphone jack.

I actually had a Galaxy S5 which I used as a GPS attached to my motorcycle's handlebars under heavy rain. It never skipped a beat. The only problem I had was that raindrops on the screen made it difficult to see the map. It was also thinner than the iPhone 7 which replaced it. Now I have an iPhone 14 pro which is even thicker than the 7.

I also had to replace the battery on that iPhone 7, which was an unbelievable PITA. Had to stand in line to talk to the service person even though I had an appointment, go away for a few hours, come back, stand in line again to pick up my phone. Fuck that. I'd much rather go to some store, buy a new battery, and replace it in less than one minute, on my terms.

So, yeah, pardon my French, but these tired arguments are just bullshit. There is prior art that proves them wrong.

Re: EU mandates replaceable batteries by 2027 (2023)

#149

Post by jszymborski »

peterfirefly wrote: post #91
mentalgear wrote: post #13

The EU is displaying exactly the kind of political leadership we need in this topic: pro-consumer, pro-environment, and firmly against planned obsolescence. Removable batteries were the industry standard in the early days of mobile phones, and it worked perfectly. We only lost that standard when Apple’s 'walled garden' mindset infected the rest of the industry. The amount of avoidable e-waste generated since then is…

> Removable batteries were the industry standard in the early days of mobile phones, and it worked perfectly. Phones back then were bad (so accommodating replaceable batteries was easy), and batteries degraded quickly (so it was a necessity). Modern phones are smaller, need to be more water proof, stuffed to an unimaginable degree with components -- and modern batteries last a really long time. I am not so sure it's…

Tell that to my Pixel 6a which hardly holds a charge over a day.

Re: EU mandates replaceable batteries by 2027 (2023)

#150

Post by concinds »

hadrien01 wrote: post #19
shablulman wrote: post #6

[flagged]

Is this comment AI-generated? All recent comments from this account are two paragraphs-long, and are a vague retelling or the article.

The horse is out of the barn. It's easy to remove AI tells in short text, and impossible to moderate. Half the stuff you read online is AI (it's always more than you think) and the fix is to log off and buy books.
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