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Adoption of EVs tied to real-world reductions in air pollution: study

keck.usc.edu

141–150 of 661 posts

Re: Adoption of EVs tied to real-world reductions in air pollution: study

#141

But don’t they cause higher pm2.5 and pm10 pollution from braking due to the fact that EVs are heavier than vehicles powered by internal combustion ?

I'm no EV expert, but I almost never use my EV's brakes — it mostly brakes using regenerative braking.

Re: Adoption of EVs tied to real-world reductions in air pollution: study

#142

No surprises. No matter how we look at it, EVs are much friendlier and safer to the environment. Some people argue the source of electricty can be contested against because that involves fossil fuel burning again, but in today's world we are rapidly moving away from it and towards nuclear/hydel/wind methods for generating power. I hope ICE cars completely become a thing of the past in the next couple of decades to co…

> No surprises. What about all the resources and people used to develop the cars?

Six months break even and then it’s more carbon friendly than an ICE for the rest of its working lifetime

Re: Adoption of EVs tied to real-world reductions in air pollution: study

#143

Having spent a significant amount of time in Bangkok - the city center (and many urban hubs) is an amazing walkable place with pedestrian walkways suspended above major roads, lots of frequent public transit (metro, skytrain) that honestly makes my home city of Sydney feel like a developing country. The only downside is that traffic creates a lot of pollution, and the engine noise (not honking, there's very little of…

Western countries will never match the new East Asian cities. All cities decay as the residents begin to oppose change. All residents begin to oppose change as they age and become wealthier. So whatever you become before the population gets rich is what you will remain.

There will be no new fast subway in San Francisco and there will be no maglev in NYC. There will be no autonomous buses in Sydney and London will be entirely devoid of skyways.

This is the nature of growth. One grows then dies as one fossilizes. The next one grows past but no one will ever reinvent themselves.

This is why death is crucial to improvement.

Re: Adoption of EVs tied to real-world reductions in air pollution: study

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My previous car had its infotainment system reboot several times while I was on the expressway. The idea of my instrument panel, or other more critical systems, crashing and rebooting while driving terrifies me.

The infotainment is not connected to the ECU and other car control electronics. At least not on my Tesla nor my F150 Lightning. You can reboot them to your hearts content while driving down the road.

Yes, but it is still rather unnerving when part of the car goes dark. It also makes me question the QA on this stuff. If that is crashing, will the other systems be crashing at some point as well? Is there redundancy? These are the questions that went through my mind while hoping the screen would come back on before I missed my exit. Even knowing the systems are completely separate, it spoke to overall quality.

Re: Adoption of EVs tied to real-world reductions in air pollution: study

#145
Something that needs to be pointed out, especially for those who want to push back against findings like this and essentially defend ICE vehicles:

Really step back and imagine a world where the modern EV [1] was first to market and a gasoline combustion engine was second.

Who would actually decide to switch from a modern EV to gasoline on purpose of their own choice?

The downsides of gasoline cars are actually pretty crazy: complicated engines and transmissions with heavy maintenance schedules, emissions, more NVH, worse interior space and packaging, need to wait for HVAC rather than it being ready ahead of time, need to go to a special gas station to add fuel, worse/slower performance.

You would have this laundry list of downsides and your only potential plus sides are faster fueling on road trips over 4 hours long, lower curb weight, and lower cost.

And those three minor down sides are very likely to be resolved sometime within the next 10-20 years.

[1] Not talking about Baker Electric type of stuff that was quickly surpassed by internal combustion of its day

Re: Adoption of EVs tied to real-world reductions in air pollution: study

#146

No surprises. No matter how we look at it, EVs are much friendlier and safer to the environment. Some people argue the source of electricty can be contested against because that involves fossil fuel burning again, but in today's world we are rapidly moving away from it and towards nuclear/hydel/wind methods for generating power. I hope ICE cars completely become a thing of the past in the next couple of decades to co…

That's framing the topic completely out of the issue with global impacts of humanity on ecosystemic sustainability, including biodiversity.

Less commut and more collective transportation is going to be far more significant in term of global impact, whatever the engine type.

Re: Adoption of EVs tied to real-world reductions in air pollution: study

#147
post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It gets studied. EVs are often heavier, which is worse for tire wear, but use regenerative braking, which is better for brake dust. Overall, EVs are likely a net win on the combination of these two things, and a big win on exhaust emissions, but it would be nice if we could shift to lighter and smaller vehicles and increase the mix of non-cars such as e-bikes and mass transit. Source: https://www.eiturbanmobility.eu/…

> but use regenerative braking, which is better for brake dust Which unfortunately also increases tire wear from regen braking during periods when an ICE vehicle would be coasting without braking. EVs are much (much much) better for CO2, much better for brake dust, and much worse for tire dust.

The tires and their dust don't care whether you're braking by regen or friction. The reason there's more dust is from the increased weight of the EV not because of regen braking. You can coast in EV as well, that is not exclusive to ICE.

Re: Adoption of EVs tied to real-world reductions in air pollution: study

#148

No surprises. No matter how we look at it, EVs are much friendlier and safer to the environment. Some people argue the source of electricty can be contested against because that involves fossil fuel burning again, but in today's world we are rapidly moving away from it and towards nuclear/hydel/wind methods for generating power. I hope ICE cars completely become a thing of the past in the next couple of decades to co…

We are about 2-3x battery capacity to never look back at ICE vehicles ever again. That or 5 min to 80% charge times with current capacity.

Re: Adoption of EVs tied to real-world reductions in air pollution: study

#149

No surprises. No matter how we look at it, EVs are much friendlier and safer to the environment. Some people argue the source of electricty can be contested against because that involves fossil fuel burning again, but in today's world we are rapidly moving away from it and towards nuclear/hydel/wind methods for generating power. I hope ICE cars completely become a thing of the past in the next couple of decades to co…

The surprising part to me is that there are now enough EVs to make a measurable difference, since I kept thinking they are still relatively rare. The linked study has this piece of data: From 2019 to 2023, ZEVs increased from 2.0% (559943 of 28237734) to 5.1% (1460818 of 28498496). So 1 out of 20 cars in California is an EV.

It really feels like more than 1 in 20 driving around the 101/280

Re: Adoption of EVs tied to real-world reductions in air pollution: study

#150
post #93
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The number of ICE cars I get stuck behind from time to time that just REEK is amazing. I’m in a decently well off area too. Some putting off soot clouds, white smoke, nothing visible but clearly not doing complete combustion. Sometimes I wonder if half the cylinders are even working. I’ve heard one car like that is the equivalent of a surprisingly large number of modern ICE cars is in good shape. I love EVs. I’ve had…

I'd say that putting off sooth clouds is a way to sequester carbon (which obviously failed to burn). Such over-enriched fuel mixes must generate much more CO though, and I wonder if those who "tune" their cars like so take care about the catalytic converter :(

The health consequences of inhaling exhaust particulates are far more harmful than the equivalent CO2 contribution to greenhouse effect warming unfortunately.

All in all, a well tuned ICE is better for everyone than a poorly tuned one, if you had to pick between the two.

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