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Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

donutlab.com

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Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#141

Post by sroussey »

JuniperMesos wrote: post #124
cosmic_cheese wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even as things currently stand, some folks just have a bone to pick with EVs. Even if future models have an 800mi range, can charge to 100% in 5 minutes, and have useful lifetimes as long or longer than ICE counterparts, some will figure out some reason to get angry about them.

A person I know is upset about EVs because they are built around the assumption that every system in the car will phone home to the car manufacturer (or perhaps the cops), and basically require you to have a proprietary smartphone app in order to interact with EV chargers and perhaps the car itself. Of course, this is also true of new ICE cars, but it's at least possible to continue driving an older ICE car with more…

I have a car without a screen at all (which is illegal to sell as a new car today), so there is no phone home and telling the insurance industry how fast I drive. Really though, it would show how little I drive.

This battery and the 5min charging for it, I thought was for the motorcycle is it going in first.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#142

Post by sroussey »

stonogo wrote: post #96
senordevnyc wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's fine, those folks can just get angrier and angrier as the market makes their ICE cars more and more difficult and expensive to own.

I'm still waiting for the EV that's a car instead of some kind of techbro reimagining of personal transportation with a 27" tv glued to the dash. So far the plug-in hybrid market is figuring that out first -- the Mazda CX90 is a real car. The VW ID3 gets close, but it still feels like someone tried to design a B-movie space ship. There's a great market out there willing to buy B-movie space ships, but if EVs are goin…

I like the "panoramic vision" screen across the base of the windshield on the BMW iX3. But wish they dropped the main screen. I only want the minimal one on the windshield, and a heads-up on the windshield. Big screens in cars are like CRT tube televisions. give me the future!

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#144

Post by sroussey »

cloudfudge wrote: post #13

From the donutlab page: > It can be charged to full in just five minutes without limiting charging to 80%, and supports full discharge safely, repeatedly, and reliably. From the motorcycle youtube video[1]: > delivers up to 370 miles (600 km) of range and adds up to 186 miles (300 km) in under 10 minutes One is claiming 100% in 5 minutes, and the other is claiming ~50% in 10 minutes. Why are their claims so different…

Verge motorcycle said they made it longer on purpose... I dunno why. Their larger battery size charges faster. They may have done some stuff to save money on the smaller 10min charging version, and maybe not as much money saving on the larger battery that charges faster.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#145

Post by sroussey »

kevinsync wrote: post #79

The press release says they're demonstrating this at CES 2026, which starts tomorrow (Jan 6, 2026) so I imagine we'll have some kind of verification one way or the other.. Or maybe CES is already happening?? [0] [0] https://www.cnet.com/home/electric-vehicles/donut-lab-produc...

Their promo video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-aPS2AwMbc

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#146

Post by zelon88 »

JuniperMesos wrote: post #124
cosmic_cheese wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even as things currently stand, some folks just have a bone to pick with EVs. Even if future models have an 800mi range, can charge to 100% in 5 minutes, and have useful lifetimes as long or longer than ICE counterparts, some will figure out some reason to get angry about them.

A person I know is upset about EVs because they are built around the assumption that every system in the car will phone home to the car manufacturer (or perhaps the cops), and basically require you to have a proprietary smartphone app in order to interact with EV chargers and perhaps the car itself. Of course, this is also true of new ICE cars, but it's at least possible to continue driving an older ICE car with more…

My concerns are the computerization of vehicles in general. The issue is not entirely with the telemetry itself, as you frame it. My issue is "what happens when the telemetry is not available?" You, and perhaps your friend, seem to be framing the problem as though the concern is that the car is filled with "spyware." My issue is that the car is filled with "DRM" from the manufacturer. When I buy a car, I expect to own that car entirely, forever. If I wanted to rent the right to someone else's car... I'd lease a car.

Musk touts the CyberTruck as "the perfect armageddon vehicle" but if you have no cell phone service how do you charge the truck? What if Tesla disappears, or GCP is down, or WW3 actually happens and the datacenters go dark? Can you operate the vehicle? What if the power goes out because... Armageddon. How do you fuel the vehicle?

What if Musk sees what I said about him on social media and accuses me of violating the TOS? Will he disable my vehicle remotely? I've seen this in the real world when a machine shop missed it's payment to Haas.

In a real armageddon, my 1997 shitbox would still function. My 2013 F150 would function right up until the EMP hit. A 2025 EV probably would not make it to a fueling source within 24 hours after the power goes out.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#147

Post by slavik81 »

stonogo wrote: post #96
senordevnyc wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's fine, those folks can just get angrier and angrier as the market makes their ICE cars more and more difficult and expensive to own.

I'm still waiting for the EV that's a car instead of some kind of techbro reimagining of personal transportation with a 27" tv glued to the dash. So far the plug-in hybrid market is figuring that out first -- the Mazda CX90 is a real car. The VW ID3 gets close, but it still feels like someone tried to design a B-movie space ship. There's a great market out there willing to buy B-movie space ships, but if EVs are goin…

> the Mazda CX90 is a real car

A Mazda 3 has been my daily driver for the past decade and I really wanted to like the Mazda CX90 PHEV when I was buying a larger vehicle last year. It was pretty difficult to justify the CX90 PHEV, though. It gets 42 km of range on an 18 kWh battery (2.4 km/kWh). For comparison, the EV9 I ended up purchasing gets 450 km of range on a 100 kWh battery (4.5 km/kWh).

Don't get me wrong. The CX90 PHEV is still the most efficient CX90 by a wide margin. I had seriously considered buying one, but the efficiency was a deal-breaker. I don't love the giant touch screen on the EV9, but I can live with it. If I couldn't, I would have gone with the Ioniq 9 for more physical controls.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#148

Post by calmbonsai »

CastIron888 wrote: post #120
calmbonsai wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real issue with "clay-like design freedom" is the collective knock-on effects of thermal and conductive inefficiencies. We've had "clay-like design freedom" since the early days of carbon-zinc batteries, but it turns out that it's far better (both for manufacturing, chemistry, and safety) to have a continuous volume of relative thermal and electrolytic quiescence that's, largely, isolated from physical strains. T…

The Fordson tractor of 1917 appears to use the engine block and transmission case as basic structural members of the tractor. Not a fast vehicle, but tough.

Eh, the monocoque was circa early 1960s and the Otto cycle was circa 1860s, but the Model T was 1900s.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#149

Post by sheepscreek »

This is so out there, checks every box imaginable or they’ve done some incredible copy writing.

So then, elephant in the room, where is the catch? It’s it the cost? They haven’t left much else -

  - made from geopolitically abundant resources
  - unlikely to catch fire
  - fully charges in 5 mins
  - does not lose capacity over cycles
  - retains 99% capacity at -30C and 100C
What is today, April 1st??

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#150

Post by schmidp »

calmbonsai wrote: post #84
jjcm wrote: post #48

One of the things I haven't seen discussed yet in the comments is this claim: Clay-like design freedom They're claiming this not only can fit custom geometries, but can be part of the structure itself. Would love to see what they're building this out of. I expect we'll see some people dissecting the verve cycle batteries soon enough.

The real issue with "clay-like design freedom" is the collective knock-on effects of thermal and conductive inefficiencies. We've had "clay-like design freedom" since the early days of carbon-zinc batteries, but it turns out that it's far better (both for manufacturing, chemistry, and safety) to have a continuous volume of relative thermal and electrolytic quiescence that's, largely, isolated from physical strains. T…

ducatis use the engine block has the frame.
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