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Apple takes down ICE tracking apps after pressure from DOJ

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Re: Apple takes down ICE tracking apps after pressure from DOJ

#141

Methinks this won’t be the last politically-motivated removal from Apple’s App Store; the more apps they remove then the more they weaken their own arguments about how a locked-in walled garden is in consumer interests.

Oh absolutely. Bondi demanded (!) they remove the app. Why would anyone think she won't demand they remove others?

[deleted]

Re: Apple takes down ICE tracking apps after pressure from DOJ

#143
post #8

FWIW, everyone who claims that Apple fundamentally needs the centralized ability to control apps on their platforms "for everyone's safety" -- despite how that obviously and repeatedly makes them become patsies for governments all over the world to enforce their censorship regimes -- are complicit in this stuff (in addition, of course, to the people who build it at Apple...).

I think that Apple is a company that has to obey the rule of law. Maybe the problem here isn’t Apple but the rules they are being forced to abide by?

> I think that Apple is a company that has to obey the rule of law.

Right, so the fundamental problem is having a device where the software that runs on it is controlled by a single company. It creates the attractive nuisance of being able to choke off anything the government doesn't like because, as you said, that single point of contact can't avoid obeying the government.

Computing needs to be open and controlled only by each individual owner of each device, so anyone can run whatever they like sourced from wherever they like.

Re: Apple takes down ICE tracking apps after pressure from DOJ

#145

Back in 2011, Apple removed apps that crowdsourced warnings about DUI checkpoints. It remains Apple's policy today. According to Grok, "In March 2011, four Democratic senators—Charles Schumer (D-N.Y.), Harry Reid (D-Nev.), Frank Lautenberg (D-N.J.), and Tom Udall (D-N.M.)—sent letters to Apple, Google, and Research in Motion (BlackBerry's parent company) urging the removal of such apps […]" So, we have precedent wher…

> to remove an app that allowed people to evade law enforcement.

No, they continued to allow police location apps (Google maps will even tell you where they are).

The language they added to the app store rules were very specific: "Apps may only display DUI checkpoints that are published by law enforcement agencies, and should never encourage drunk driving or other reckless behavior such as excessive speed."

Whether or not that was a good idea at the time (it wasn't), you can't claim this is covered by the same guidelines.

Re: Apple takes down ICE tracking apps after pressure from DOJ

#146
post #8

FWIW, everyone who claims that Apple fundamentally needs the centralized ability to control apps on their platforms "for everyone's safety" -- despite how that obviously and repeatedly makes them become patsies for governments all over the world to enforce their censorship regimes -- are complicit in this stuff (in addition, of course, to the people who build it at Apple...).

The problem isn't the centralized control, it's the power the governments have.

> The problem isn't the centralized control, it's the power the governments have.

The governments will always have the power, that's pretty much built into the definition of government.

So, technology needs to be built with this reality in mind. Thus, avoid all centralization.

Re: Apple takes down ICE tracking apps after pressure from DOJ

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the number of shares you personally own is irrelevant. The only public companies that ever take long term bets are those that are still founder led.

> Cook, clearly trying to remain calm, shot back: “When we work on making our devices accessible by the blind, I don’t consider the bloody ROI [return on investment]. When I think about doing the right thing, I don’t think about an ROI.” > Cook then offered his own bottom line to Danhof, or any other critic, one which perfectly sums up his belief that social and political and moral leadership are not antithetical to…

Making devices accessible cost pennies compared to their revenue and didn’t take any real courage. Come back to me when they stand by their convictions when it can cost them billions in tariffs

Re: Apple takes down ICE tracking apps after pressure from DOJ

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that Apple is a company that has to obey the rule of law. Maybe the problem here isn’t Apple but the rules they are being forced to abide by?

> Apple is a company that has to obey the rule of law Damn right. Where is the court order? Pursuant to what law?

[flagged]

Re: Apple takes down ICE tracking apps after pressure from DOJ

#149
post #8

FWIW, everyone who claims that Apple fundamentally needs the centralized ability to control apps on their platforms "for everyone's safety" -- despite how that obviously and repeatedly makes them become patsies for governments all over the world to enforce their censorship regimes -- are complicit in this stuff (in addition, of course, to the people who build it at Apple...).

I think that Apple is a company that has to obey the rule of law. Maybe the problem here isn’t Apple but the rules they are being forced to abide by?

The point is that if you could install the app by side loading it, or from a third party app store, then a Government order to remove an app doesn't make it impossible to use that app. But Apples actions, ostensibly to protect its users, but in reality to protect its profits, has put it in a situation where it is a much more effective tool for government censorship.

Re: Apple takes down ICE tracking apps after pressure from DOJ

#150
post #98

Why are people so obsessed about apps. could be a website that couldn’t easily be taken down.

what if you want a push notification when ICE agents appear in your work area?

Maybe an SMS based approach would be preferred over an app notification.
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