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An opinionated critique of Duolingo

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Re: An opinionated critique of Duolingo

#141

Post by [deleted] »

midtake wrote: post #123
Uehreka wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an app that constantly nags you to use it, to the point that its mascot is so widely known as annoying that they play it for laughs in their ads. All that to say: you and Duolingo’s owners may disagree about what “the point of Duolingo is”. I don’t think they care if users are achieving fluency, they want users to keep coming back to the app so they can be served ads. And yeah, that doesn’t mean users can’t t…

Most apps are nagware, that is not a Duolingo issue. The ads are for converting users to paid subscribers, not just "ads." I don't see your point at all.

[deleted]

Re: An opinionated critique of Duolingo

#142

Post by agnishom »

jnsie wrote: post #94

I think it's important for those responding about their Duolingo experience to include the tier that they are using. Specifically, I wonder if the conversations with AI, and the "explain this" feature in Duolingo Max change outcomes? I'm new to Duolingo, chose the max tier, and feel that I'm learning quite a bit specifically because I am having simple conversations in French daily (albeit with an AI that seems to me…

I totally believe that (some) people are achieving great results at the free tier.

I am definitely not saying that Duolingo is useless or a bad (i.e, net negative) use of someone's time. But even good things are not immune to criticism

Re: An opinionated critique of Duolingo

#143

Post by xormapmap »

hungryhobbit wrote: post #126
jmkni wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what's the hack? I'm guessing there isn't one? Asking as it's "hacker news" after all, I remember reading how North Korean agents would watch shows like Friends for hours on end to become familiar with English, is that a hack?

As others have said, immersion is the only way that you have control of. If you could de-age yourself, becoming a child would also help immensely, as child brains are much better at learning languages.

The idea that child brains are better at learning languages is a myth. Adults struggle with languages because traditional language education is not fit for purpose. If you took a child and isolated them in such a way that they never got comprehensible input, and instead only gave them traditional language lessons (think textbooks, grammar drills) - they too would struggle. The good news is that if you take an adult and give them comprehensible input like you would a child, they will learn at least as effectively as a child.

Re: An opinionated critique of Duolingo

#144

Post by stackedinserter »

If it's 2025 and you people still use Duolingo, then probably they just like to use Duolingo. It's like people who grind grammar books – both ways to learn language are dead ends, but make people feel better because "look I have 1000 days streak in Spanish" ("I can write conjugations for 100 verbs").

If DL taught me something, it's that it's better to completely ignore any gamifications, streaks, "hours of input", levels and other metrics that language learning services give you. It's easy to get into trap of using them as KPI of your learning process, and not your ability to speak to other people.

Re: An opinionated critique of Duolingo

#146

Post by agnishom »

kej wrote: post #53

A lot of Duolingo criticisms to me read like someone saying "I was walking on a home treadmill for 30 minutes every day but I didn't really get in shape until I started spending 5 hours each week in the gym with a professional trainer." Yes, obviously an actual class with a qualified teacher is going to teach you a language faster than Duolingo. Obviously you will learn faster if you move to a foreign country or if y…

Now you are making me feel bad about walking on the treadmill for 30 minutes.

Jk, I agree with you but that doesn't mean there are no meaningful criticisms of the treadmill

Re: An opinionated critique of Duolingo

#147

Post by projektfu »

spogbiper wrote: post #76
projektfu wrote: post #56

I think Duo could be a good way to get started on language learning, but it is not effective on its own. What it lacks is an obvious way to graduate from its call and response mechanic to synthesis, as in creating your own sentences and participating in conversation. Tandem was a good way for me to improve my Spanish to the point that I felt comfortable traveling. I dropped Duolingo pretty soon after starting on Tand…

I think duolingo is taking some steps. Not sure how effective they will be. they have added some "write your own sentence" exercises in recent months. generally a story you listen to and then you write a summary or answer a question about why or how something happened in your own words. your sentence is then graded/corrected by AI. these are still rare but they do make me think more than the typical forms. there is a…

Interesting, I haven't used it in a long time. For me, when you tell me to talk to a computer, I can't have a real conversation with it. I'm as awkward as a middle schooler in that scenario.

Re: An opinionated critique of Duolingo

#148

Post by collinmcnulty »

Escapado wrote: post #135
hungryhobbit wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As others have said, immersion is the only way that you have control of. If you could de-age yourself, becoming a child would also help immensely, as child brains are much better at learning languages.

I keep hearing this but sometimes I am not 100% sure if they are _much_ better so asking honestly: Is there any reputable quantitative analysis of this in the context of language learning? For example: I have spent the last two years in japan (I am in my 30s) and just got back to my home country. Went to a language school in the mornings there, immersed myself in the language a little but did not go all out on studyi…

My strong suspicion is that children just have no responsibilities and are socially allowed to not be able to talk while everyone will speak at their level with a great deal of patience.

Re: An opinionated critique of Duolingo

#149

Post by nikeee »

torm wrote: post #45

I'm currently holding a 1100 days of streak of Italian in Duolingo, so I think I am entitled to drop in my 2 cents ;) To some extent I agree with the critique. Would I be able to write an assay like the op in Italian? surely not. Is their marketing annoying? yes, very much. Is the platform perfect? far from this. However - after 3 years with Duo I am capable of having causal, simple conversations, I can navigate most…

IIRC the CEO(?) of Duolingo was asked what he would choose if he had to choose between a more effective language course and more gamification. His answer was gamification, because the best course doesn't help anyone if noone shows up. So at least they know that it's not the best way of learning a language.

Re: An opinionated critique of Duolingo

#150

Post by jnsie »

agnishom wrote: post #142
jnsie wrote: post #94

I think it's important for those responding about their Duolingo experience to include the tier that they are using. Specifically, I wonder if the conversations with AI, and the "explain this" feature in Duolingo Max change outcomes? I'm new to Duolingo, chose the max tier, and feel that I'm learning quite a bit specifically because I am having simple conversations in French daily (albeit with an AI that seems to me…

I totally believe that (some) people are achieving great results at the free tier. I am definitely not saying that Duolingo is useless or a bad (i.e, net negative) use of someone's time. But even good things are not immune to criticism

> I totally believe that (some) people are achieving great results at the free tier. I am definitely not saying that Duolingo is useless or a bad (i.e, net negative) use of someone's time.

I definitely didn't mean to imply otherwise

> But even good things are not immune to criticism

100%

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