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Models of European metro stations

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Re: Models of European metro stations

#141

Post by [deleted] »

dmoy wrote: post #113
decimalenough wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have stats for India, and they're no match: Kolkata Howrah gets about 1M pax per day, Mumbai CST around 670k. Nothing to sneeze at, but still several million (!) less than Shinjuku. China has numerous airport-sized stations that handle huge volumes of long-distance passengers, but I'm not aware of any single commuter hub remotely the size of Shinjuku. Partly this is because of the economic system: Chinese trains a…

> I'm not aware of any single commuter hub remotely the size of Shinjuku There certainly isn't one that does the volume of passengers. Shanghai Hongqiao or Beijing South are probably busiest, and they're 3-4x less passengers than Shinjuku. > Partly this is because of the economic system: Chinese trains are all state-run and centralized, while a large part of why Shinjuku is so busy is that it's a hub for numerous pri…

[deleted]

Re: Models of European metro stations

#142

Post by bobthepanda »

numpad0 wrote: post #122
dmoy wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm not aware of any single commuter hub remotely the size of Shinjuku There certainly isn't one that does the volume of passengers. Shanghai Hongqiao or Beijing South are probably busiest, and they're 3-4x less passengers than Shinjuku. > Partly this is because of the economic system: Chinese trains are all state-run and centralized, while a large part of why Shinjuku is so busy is that it's a hub for numerous pri…

> 3-4x less passengers than Shinjuku Exactly what I meant by comparable - those are within 10x. The up to date, yet still suspiciously Japan-dominated table on Wikipedia[1] has couple Indian and Chinese stations within top 20s, as I suspected. The must be more complete data in some non-English forms that has not been pulled into the English bubble on the WWW. I believe I've been to stations like Daimon-Hamamatsucho a…

Shinjuku being as concentrated as it is, is mostly a historical accident. Prewar Japan prohibited mainline railway options inside the Yamanote ring, because old steam railways took up a lot of room with yards and were very polluting; and and so you have all the suburban and long distance railways stopping or going around the ring (the notable exception being the Chuo Line which was built before that regulation). And the flattest, largest, and most attractive land development areas were west of the Yamanote ring so most trains ended up at Shibuya, or Shinjuku, or Ikebukuro, which round out the top three stations in Japan. This led to a lot of problems as these stations became more overcrowded with people changing from mainline suburban trains onto local transportation services. The through-running subways of Tokyo were developed largely to fix this, by allowing trains to pass through into the formerly prohibited city center so that people would stay on the same train instead of clogging up the platforms and stairwells and passageways by transferring. As more railways were able to through run, that lessened the need for yards to store trains that were no longer terminating, and they became large parcels of redevelopment that begot even more ridership.

To some degree, future planners learned from this by not overly concentrating passenger flows at a handful of stations; and by the time they were rapidly urbanizing, trains had become electric and there wasn't really any good reason to stop trains from entering central cities anymore. If you look at the Seoul or Beijing or Shanghai networks, they are intentionally a large, overlapping grid with many transfers to reduce the load on any single station.

Re: Models of European metro stations

#143

Post by wkat4242 »

kmarc wrote: post #86
izacus wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the most mind blowing things for me was seeing that river Sihl flows through Hbf between the tracks.

To be precise it flows above (and under) the tracks, as in, perpendicular, not "in between" parallel tracks. BTW Hbf is a München thing, we call our beloved Zürich Hauptbahnhof just HB :-)

I think Hbf is a Germany thing not just Munich.

Re: Models of European metro stations

#144

Post by wkat4242 »

rwmj wrote: post #22
sschueller wrote: post #20

Wow, very nice project. The ones in Zürich are not actually metro stations. They where built to be, but then the city voted against a metro. The stations that were already built were converted into tram stations. There where some complications like that fact the the tram is almost too tall to fit. The pantograph is almost fully compressed when the tram enters the tunnel. The trams also switch to the left side as the…

I'd love to know why you'd vote against having a metro.

From what I read it was in the 70s in a phase of anti globalisation and growth. Of course in those days car traffic was much lower than now. I bet Zürich residents would be really happy to have had one now. Where I live we have both metro and tram and the metro is so much more efficient due to longer trains, more frequent departures, never being held up by traffic etc.

Re: Models of European metro stations

#145

Post by wkat4242 »

rsynnott wrote: post #133
jddj wrote: post #15

Very impressive work. I also learned something, which I'd always wondered cynically but never thought to investigate. The walking connection between lines at some stations in Barcelona seems so long as to not make sense, but it's explained here that at the time the different lines and stations were dug and extended independently by different companies. > Among the reasons for having such long corridors [in Barcelona]…

Are there at least multiple entrances? Dublin's main station, Connolly, is actually the amalgamation of two stations, one terminal station and one through station, which were originally owned by different companies before the rail system was nationalised. The only entrances are through the terminal station, so to get to the through lines, you need to walk for about 10 minutes through the terminal station (making them…

It's a bit crazy though that the stations aren't connected. If you want to go from Galway to Belfast you have to go across the city from Heuston station to Connolly. Very annoying with baggage even though these days there's the Luas. And there is actually a rail connection between the two stations (going up to the north from just before Heuston). They could have a quick service between the two. A bit like the dart in the east.

Dublin would be so much better off with a real metro. The bus service is terrible, the Luas only has two lines and focuses a lot on the suburbs.

Re: Models of European metro stations

#146

Post by lansol »

rsynnott wrote: post #129

A while back I was in Berlin, and got lost in Nollendorfplatz station (which is not particularly _big_) for about ten minutes. Now, for various reasons I had been awake for about 36 hours, so mostly blamed it on that, but if this site is correct it confirms my suspicion that that is a weird station. U1 and U3 are on different levels for different directions!

Maybe not common, but not an uncommon design. It is so you can transfer between lines by crossing the platform.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross-platform_interchange https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5hXH_mLPzw

Re: Models of European metro stations

#147

Post by robertlutece »

seabass-labrax wrote: post #111
decimalenough wrote: post #26

Here's a zoomable 3D model of the world's busiest train station, Shinjuku in Tokyo: https://satoshi7190.github.io/Shinjuku-indoor-threejs-demo/ 3.6 million passengers per day . Wikipedia: The main East Japan Railway Company (JR East) station and the directly adjacent private railways have a total of 35 platforms, an underground arcade, above-ground arcade and numerous hallways with another 17 platforms (52 total) tha…

Is this actually to scale? If so, do the near-vertical moving dashed lines depict inclined lifts or escalators? Because they look very steep when you compare them to other metro escalators, such as those in the Brussels Metro's Porte de Hal / Hallepoort station[1], which seem closer to 50° from horizontal. [1]: http://estacions.albertguillaumes.cat/img/brusselles/porte_d...

I believe the floors have been pulled further apart to help with navigating around the model which would also steepen the escalators.

Re: Models of European metro stations

#148

Post by joshvm »

kmarc wrote: post #86
izacus wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the most mind blowing things for me was seeing that river Sihl flows through Hbf between the tracks.

To be precise it flows above (and under) the tracks, as in, perpendicular, not "in between" parallel tracks. BTW Hbf is a München thing, we call our beloved Zürich Hauptbahnhof just HB :-)

Yes, my mistake - it's been a while! Definitely a local thing, and always with German pronunciation. There were a several words/phrases like that which got loaned into English. Doubly confusing because it wasn't always clear if the new word was Züri, regular Swiss-German, French but not Swiss-German, or High German. Had to be careful using new vocab in Germany!

Re: Models of European metro stations

#149

Post by kmarc »

joshvm wrote: post #148
kmarc wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be precise it flows above (and under) the tracks, as in, perpendicular, not "in between" parallel tracks. BTW Hbf is a München thing, we call our beloved Zürich Hauptbahnhof just HB :-)

Yes, my mistake - it's been a while! Definitely a local thing, and always with German pronunciation. There were a several words/phrases like that which got loaned into English. Doubly confusing because it wasn't always clear if the new word was Züri, regular Swiss-German, French but not Swiss-German, or High German. Had to be careful using new vocab in Germany!

Not to mention that the locals here when referring to it while speaking English, totally translate it to "eɪʧ biː" sometimes.

Other times, in the middle English sentence, the German pronunciation pops up "ˈhaː ˈbeː"

Fun

Re: Models of European metro stations

#150

Post by ExoticPearTree »

walterlw wrote: post #17

Very impressive work. Was very saddened to see how Ukrainian Kyiv and Kharkiv stations were excluded. We have deep stations (like Arsenal'na at 105m that connects directly to the above-ground Dnipro station on a river bank), we have both Soviet-made and new stations. Also now they are doubly essential being used for both transportation and shelter during air raids by millions.

Can we not politicize the hard work of a person? In NY there's only a handful of stations drawn and not a single american complained about it.
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