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I bought the cheapest EV, a used Nissan Leaf

jeffgeerling.com

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Re: I bought the cheapest EV, a used Nissan Leaf

#141

Post by rsynnott »

nicce wrote: post #124
rsynnott wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For practical purposes it is a 15 year old design; it had a minor update 8 years ago, but was not brought up to date with the norms of the time (in particular, the passively cooled battery). This was the very first mass-market electric car, with only minor tweaks. It's not surprising that it's a bit rough around the edges. That's part of why they're cheap second-hand (along with the fact that the 3rd gen, which actua…

I don't think that we can use the general "old" here. The statement should have been more explicit and include the design of the battery. If the model gets even minor updates, manufacturing is happening right now, the car is either good enough or new enough in general, and we cannot use old as negative quality. Electric motors existed before the combustion engine, and people keep talking about "rapidly evolving area"…

The problems with this car are all around the battery pack (though honestly these problems are a little exaggerated). The battery pack is, for practical purposes, a 15 year old design. This car is no longer made. When it was being made, it was the only electric car you could buy with such an old battery pack design.

Buying a 2nd-gen Leaf in 2025 would be a bit silly, unless you were getting a major discount.

Re: I bought the cheapest EV, a used Nissan Leaf

#142

Post by ponector »

theshrike79 wrote: post #70
mschuster91 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Limiting QC events is easy enough. A daily commuter vehicle can easily trickle charge over night, and even the measly 40 kWh old used Leaf can get you 200km a charge - assuming an average commute of 20 km for Germany, that's a whole work week worth of battery life. The only time you as an average person actually "need" QC is for the yearly vacation road trip, but as the author writes, renting an ICE or chungus electr…

This is the thing that ICE people need to internalise. You THINK you're driving long distances every day and you THINK charging is a massive hassle where you have to drive to a Charging Site and wait for the car to charge for HOURS. When in reality you plug in at home and have a full battery every morning. And when the infrastructure is properly built (yay Finland), you can get a week's charge when you're getting gro…

>> When in reality you plug in at home and have a full battery every morning

Right, but I should buy a house with a garage first.

>> charge when you're getting groceries as the shop has multiple 100kW

Unless you do groceries in unusual time, those chargers are occupied. Will you wait in line then?

Re: I bought the cheapest EV, a used Nissan Leaf

#143

Post by magicalhippo »

masklinn wrote: post #25

> Lack of standards: For 'L3' DC Fast Charging, the Leaf has a CHAdeMO port. Teslas and many newer EVs have NACS. Then there's CCS1 and CCS2. And charging stations are run by multiple vendors with multiple apps and payment methods. It's not like gas stations, like with Shell, BP, Buckee's, etc. where you just drive up, stick the gas nozzle in your tank, and squeeze. Afaik in Europe, CCS2 is the standard (and mandator…

> And that the rental company (AVIS) does not provide an AC adapter

Here in Norway, new EVs are no longer allowed to be sold with AC adapters, due to the potential fire hazard. At least that's the reason I got when I purchased my current EV.

Perhaps a EU thing, wouldn't surprise me.

Re: I bought the cheapest EV, a used Nissan Leaf

#144

Post by marcusb »

nottorp wrote: post #127
marcusb wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've driven an EV on 500 mile trips. Getting out and stretching your legs for 20-25 minutes once every three hours isn't "super annoying." If all I did was drive around all day, every day for 500 miles at a stretch, it might be, but not nearly as annoying as routinely driving for 500 miles. For most people, the vast majority of their driving takes place well within the range of the typical BEV and range anxiety is a…

This is tiring. Not everyone lives in the suburbs with a plug at ground level and getting out and stretching your legs is great when you choose where you do it but not when you do it in the queue for charging...

Maybe its tiring for you. What’s tiring for me is that in every single one of these threads, people bring up the most extreme, outlier situations (500 mile trips) as a cudgel against EVs.

Re: I bought the cheapest EV, a used Nissan Leaf

#145

Post by marcusb »

sillyfluke wrote: post #130
marcusb wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've driven an EV on 500 mile trips. Getting out and stretching your legs for 20-25 minutes once every three hours isn't "super annoying." If all I did was drive around all day, every day for 500 miles at a stretch, it might be, but not nearly as annoying as routinely driving for 500 miles. For most people, the vast majority of their driving takes place well within the range of the typical BEV and range anxiety is a…

>Getting out and stretching your legs for 20-25 minutes once every three hours isn't "super annoying." Nothing done by choice is annoying obviously. But a lot of people are fine with stretching their legs on a five minute bathroom break. Adding an extra an hour or hour half for unwanted stops due to forced recharging is what annoys them.

> Nothing done by choice is annoying obviously.

Right, so that covers approximately 100% of EV owners.

Re: I bought the cheapest EV, a used Nissan Leaf

#147

Post by teamonkey »

Hamuko wrote: post #84
formerly_proven wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm guessing it skirts regulations by being a PHEV, since CCS2 is mandatory for DCFC otherwise. Skirting regulations is quite fitting for a PHEV, of course, as that is their raison d'etre.

The outgoing Nissan Leaf also has CHAdeMO and that's a full BEV.

The incoming Leaf has CCS2

Re: I bought the cheapest EV, a used Nissan Leaf

#148

Post by fifilura »

stavros wrote: post #104
masklinn wrote: post #25

> Lack of standards: For 'L3' DC Fast Charging, the Leaf has a CHAdeMO port. Teslas and many newer EVs have NACS. Then there's CCS1 and CCS2. And charging stations are run by multiple vendors with multiple apps and payment methods. It's not like gas stations, like with Shell, BP, Buckee's, etc. where you just drive up, stick the gas nozzle in your tank, and squeeze. Afaik in Europe, CCS2 is the standard (and mandator…

I can confirm that, here in Greece, everything is CCS2. There are also CHAdeMO ports here and there, but I don't know what car uses those. However, I haven't seen a station that takes card yet (or they don't advertise it). They all have their own app, which is inconvenient and a hassle.

> but I don't know what car uses those

It is exactly this kind of Nissan Leaf. Japanese older generation cars. Enough around to still be available, but I think it is slowly disappearing. After that only 6kW (32A/single phase) charging will be available for these cars.

Re: I bought the cheapest EV, a used Nissan Leaf

#149

Post by ruperthair »

fusslo wrote: post #138
Bairfhionn wrote: post #24

My Problem was always the Range Anxiety. Until I got an EV and realized it's not really an issue. There is always an App for that (and even on my car the software gets improved in that regard). Infrastructure is getting better, even companies starting to see it as a benefit to have cheap/free chargers at their offices to get people back. I see more and more electric trucks on the roads. It feels good.

is there a term like 'charge anxiety'? I was debating an electric vehicle in 2023. There are maybe 10 people (out of about 200) at work that have electric cars. My teammate is one of the ten. He wakes up early to get a charger. He tracks down the other owners to ask them to use the charger after lunch. They started a group chat about the chargers. My local grocery store has a bank of superchargers right in the middle…

I have the same issue with a lack of charging at home, and totally identify with what you say here. The lack of an organised queue (could be in the provider's app, rather than a physical one) at oversubscribed charging stations is the worst thing about EV driving for me.

Re: I bought the cheapest EV, a used Nissan Leaf

#150

Post by 1970-01-01 »

Its fun to witness EVs living up to their original promise. Yes, the 1st generation of EVs without battery heating and cooling were mostly disposable experiments to catch-up with Tesla. That much is fact. However, the late model, new-wave of EVs (with proper battery technology) have crushed every excuse, except for variety.
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