141–150 of 256 posts
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Ladybird has better results in web rendering tests than Servo, and slowly is gaining on Firefox. They are already quite competitive.
Ladybird is extremely slow, it's far from being competitive at all.
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I've heard the same thing about monetising search engines. Kagi didn't get the memo, and last I've heard they're turning a profit. Sure, only nerds would pay for it, but not all products have to capture 100% market share.
But independent browsers need this metric. Good luck convincing website owners to test against your non-chromium browser with 0.3% market share.
(They don't even block the streams, only logins. I can watch, but not spend money. Perfectly reasonable.)
While it's hard to know what comes of it, there is also https://ladybird.org/ to challenge to monopoly of Blink.
I have to be honest that I don't really understand the appeal of Ladybird from a purely technical perspective. It is written in C++, just like all the existing engines (yes there is some Swift, but it is negligible), so what benefit does it provide over Gecko or Blink? With Servo, I can see there is a distinct technical design around security and parallelism.
Also: Andreas has worked on Webkit/Blink. He knew what he was doing when he started the project, even if it was "just for fun". Linux started under similar circumstances.
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I'll see if I can find it. I don't remember the specifics on rust, but it sounded like they gave it a fair shot. It was basically the one to beat until they figured out it wasn't going to work. The decision to adopt Swift wasn't made on a whim and, frankly, I'm skeptical it will happen any time soon, if ever. I think it's one of those situations where they want to make it more accessible to a next generation of devel…
> [Rust] was basically the one to beat until they figured out it wasn't going to work. I'd love to know more about this.
Here are some key quotes: "something that matters to us a lot is OO. Web specs & browser internals tend to be highly object-oriented, and life is easier when you can model specs closely in your code."
"So what I’ve done is I’ve asked a bunch of people to “Please implement these things in a couple of different languages. And then we can talk about how that went, what you liked about each language, and which one you would like to work in every day.” And what we ended up with was that people were initially excited to work in Rust, because there’s a lot of hype, and it’s like a popular language… And you would think that it’s the greatest thing since sliced bread… And in many ways it is, if what you want is sliced bread. Or I don’t know where I’m going with that. But it works well for a lot of things."
"But it turns out it’s not ideal for building a browser… Because the browser stack sits on top of this API that was designed in the ’90s, inspired by Java and XML and stuff like that at the time. This ‘90s API, and it set the core of the web stack. And it’s super object-oriented, and it’s just hard to express all that stuff in Rust, because Rust doesn’t lend itself to object-oriented programming. It doesn’t have inheritance, for example, which is a very fundamental building block."
"And so what happened was I asked people to write in Rust, and they were initially excited, and then they came back frustrated. And nobody had a good time working in Rust, as far as I understood, when doing anything but trivial programs that like take an input and transform it into something else. The moment you try to model something, sort of in a browser space, it just became tedious."
"So we looked at some other languages, and the one that everybody has liked so far has been Swift. So it’s a bit of an unlikely candidate, but we decided to look at it, because it is a safe, modern language, that has great object-oriented programming capabilities. I would say it’s even better than C++ in many ways. And it’s a little weird, because it feels like an Apple product almost, but they’ve been making great strides on Linux and Windows. Especially now, the upcoming Swift 6 is looking like it’s going to be a really good release on other platforms as well… So that’s sort of where the ship is pointing right now. We haven’t committed to it, because we’re still figuring out how to do some things, but it’s been really positive, and everybody’s enjoyed working in it, myself included. It’s been fantastic. So that’s sort of what we’re looking at."
> This is a danger to the open web in more ways than one. If there is only one functioning implementation of a standard, the implementation becomes the standard. I still don't understand why this is a problem. As long as the engine implementing the spec - governed by committee formed by entities other than Google itself - is open source. The problem and the waste of resource is how we are behaving now. The browser en…
Try spending a month with a BSD - personally, I recommend OpenBSD, or (yes) macOS. Alternatively, try ZFS where you've previously used mdadm+lvm+luks+etc.
The difference is like sitting in a chair that has all of its screws tightened. You only notice how bad was your previous chair once you feel there's no wobbling.
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But independent browsers need this metric. Good luck convincing website owners to test against your non-chromium browser with 0.3% market share.
Twitch randomly blocks Chromium. (They don't even block the streams, only logins. I can watch, but not spend money. Perfectly reasonable.)
While it's hard to know what comes of it, there is also https://ladybird.org/ to challenge to monopoly of Blink.
I have to be honest that I don't really understand the appeal of Ladybird from a purely technical perspective. It is written in C++, just like all the existing engines (yes there is some Swift, but it is negligible), so what benefit does it provide over Gecko or Blink? With Servo, I can see there is a distinct technical design around security and parallelism.
> The Dogemania test ran at a smooth 60 FPS on my M4 Pro MacBook Pro until reaching around 400 images I ran Dogemania on Chrome until 1400 images at steady 60 FPS at which point I got bored and closed the tab.
Wow, just did this myself. The difference between Firefox and Chromium was depressing. I'm getting >100 FPS almost consistently all the way up to 1,000 in Chromium, FF barely made it above 500 before dropping below 60. Probably not a completely fair test, I've no extensions etc. on Chromium and only use it for the odd stubborn website, but that was quite a lesson in their comparative performance.
Chromium hit below 60fps at around 4000 and below 30fps at 6000 but used my integrated intel GPU all the time.
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The end of Pocket is just another sad example. As an April fools joke, Mozilla should announce that they are discontinuing Firefox in order to focus on their core business, which is a beautiful abstraction: the Platonic ideal of discontinuing popular products.
Strange. I remember reading nothing but complaints about Pocket when they bought and integrated it. I guess it grew on people.