Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

DeepSeek R2 launch stalled as CEO balks at progress

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

141–150 of 186 posts

Re: DeepSeek R2 launch stalled as CEO balks at progress

#141

Post by ethbr1 »

jaggs wrote: post #135
ethbr1 wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm also not really sure what's wrong with the moral compass of the Chinese communist party? From what I can see at the moment it is authoritative, but not necessarily venal? It's certainly corrupt. Xi didn't launch major, disruptive anti-corruption drives for no reason, but because he saw it as an existential threat to the CCP's legitimacy (after all, it did torpedo the Soviet Union). Granted, an alternate rationa…

I think stones in glass houses comes to mind right now? :)

The fact that the US still has functioning separation of powers is counter evidence.

People may gripe about fuzzy areas being stepped on and norms pushed (and they should gripe!), but there's a huge chasm between separation of powers in democracies and China.

Re: DeepSeek R2 launch stalled as CEO balks at progress

#142

Post by missedthecue »

Papazsazsa wrote: post #39
Aeolun wrote: post #37

So Nvidia stock is going to crash hard when the Chinese inevitably produce their own competitive chip. Though I’m baffled by the fact they don’t just license and pump out billions of AMD chips. Nvidia is ahead, but not that far ahead. My consumer AMD card (7900 XTX) outperforms the 15x more expensive Nvidia server chip (L40S) that I was using.

I don't know why this isn't the crux of our current geopolitical spat. Surely it would be cheaper and easier for the CCP to develop their own chipmaking capacity than going to war in the Taiwan strait?

China has wanted reunification since before the invention of the transistor.

Re: DeepSeek R2 launch stalled as CEO balks at progress

#143

Post by jaggs »

ethbr1 wrote: post #141
jaggs wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think stones in glass houses comes to mind right now? :)

The fact that the US still has functioning separation of powers is counter evidence. People may gripe about fuzzy areas being stepped on and norms pushed (and they should gripe!), but there's a huge chasm between separation of powers in democracies and China.

Calling in the marine guard without congress approval seems a little bit un-separate, but I'm not an expert so I'm not going to continue this conversation. You have an opinion and I have my very inexpert one too.

Re: DeepSeek R2 launch stalled as CEO balks at progress

#144

Post by ethbr1 »

jaggs wrote: post #143
ethbr1 wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that the US still has functioning separation of powers is counter evidence. People may gripe about fuzzy areas being stepped on and norms pushed (and they should gripe!), but there's a huge chasm between separation of powers in democracies and China.

Calling in the marine guard without congress approval seems a little bit un-separate, but I'm not an expert so I'm not going to continue this conversation. You have an opinion and I have my very inexpert one too.

The Marines were rebased within the bounds of Constitutional and legal powers, as was the National Guard federalization and deployment.

Not agreeing with a thing doesn't make it illegal.

If Congress wants to prohibit Presidents from pushing these areas, then they're free to do so. (And expect they will once the clock tocks)

Re: DeepSeek R2 launch stalled as CEO balks at progress

#145

Post by CamperBob2 »

vbezhenar wrote: post #127
CamperBob2 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, at least protecting Latin American countries from the threat of communism was a nice thing for us to do, wasn't it? Communism would certainly have done more harm than we did. The lesson of present-day America is that democracy is too important to be left to the people.

Communism is good. By "protecting" them from communism, you doomed them to the horrors of capitalism.

You don't have to hold a gun to someone's head to get them to practice capitalism. People will trade labor, goods and services voluntarily unless you go out of your way to stop them.

And spare us the false equivalence bullshit that we all know is coming.

Re: DeepSeek R2 launch stalled as CEO balks at progress

#146

Post by CamperBob2 »

throwaway290 wrote: post #82
rescbr wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> against violent dictatorships Then look up Latin America’s history, where the US actively worked to install and support such violent dictatorships. Some under the guise of protecting countries from the threat of communism - like Brazil, Argentina and Chile, and some explicitly to protect US company’s interests - like in Guatemala

> Chile Yes fuckups happened. But then for results Russian intervention see CCP and how many people died from their hands and policies

Well, that's different. The Russians meant well, you see.

Re: DeepSeek R2 launch stalled as CEO balks at progress

#147

Post by pama »

terafo wrote: post #80
reliabilityguy wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Using H20 to serve DeepSeek V3 / R1 is just SUPER inefficient. Like, R1 is the most anti-H20 model released ever. Why? Any chance you have some links to read about why it’s the case?

MLA uses way more flops in order to conserve memory bandwidth, H20 has plenty of memory bandwidth and almost no flops. MLA makes sense on H100/H800, but on H20 GQA-based models are a way better option.

Not sure what you are referring to—do you have a pointer to a technical writeup perhaps? In training and inference MLA has way less flops than MHA, which is the gold standard, and way better accuracy (model performance) than GQA (see comparisons in the DeepSeek papers or try deepseek models vs llama for long context.)

More generally, with any hardware architecture you use, you can optimize the throughput for your main goal (initially training; later inference) by balancing other parameters of the architecture. Even if training is suboptimal, if you want to make a global impact with a public model, you aim for the next NVidia inference hardware.

Re: DeepSeek R2 launch stalled as CEO balks at progress

#148

Post by pama »

rsanek wrote: post #102

"wildly popular"? maybe there was alot of interest when it was released, but who even is still using R1 these days? i previously utilized it through perplexity but the o3/Gemini pro models are so much better i rarely bother to read its responses. it's not even in the top ten based on OpenRouter https://openrouter.ai/rankings?view=month

V3 is number 5 in your list. R1-0528(free) is number11 and R1(free) is number15. Openrouter separates the free (in the top 20 list you shared) vs paid (further down) instances of V3 and R1, and of course it doesnt count the direct connection to the providers, or the various self-hosted solutions (choice of companies working in sensitive areas, including many of my friends).

Re: DeepSeek R2 launch stalled as CEO balks at progress

#149

Post by FirmwareBurner »

crazygringo wrote: post #100
sschueller wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> lack of GPU capacity due to export restrictions Human progress that benefits everyone being stalled by the few and powerful who want to keep their moats. Sad world we live in.

It's not about people wanting to keep it in moats. It's about China being expansionist, actively preparing to invade Taiwan, and generally becoming an increasing military threat that does not respect the national integrity of other states. The US is fine with other countries having AI if the countries "play nice" with others. Nobody is limiting GPU's in France or Thailand. This is very specific to China's behavior an…

>It's about China being expansionist, actively preparing to invade Taiwan, and generally becoming an increasing military threat that does not respect the national integrity of other states.

Remove the word Taiwan and you are describing the US.

>It's about China being expansionist

US has been doing that since their inception as a country. Are you telling me the USs 750 foreign military bases located in at least 80 foreign countries and territories is NOT expansionism? Come on!

>actively preparing to invade Taiwan

The US illegally invaded Iraq and Afghanistan for 20 years killing and torturing innocents in the process and leaving the Taliban in power to further cause harm. Wow many countries did China invade? Yet somehow China is the boogieman? Please!

> generally becoming an increasing military threat that does not respect the national integrity of other states.

Same with the US, Trump threatened to annex Greenland and Canada, yet I don't see sanctions on the US.

I don't see the US having any ground to stand on criticizing China.

Re: DeepSeek R2 launch stalled as CEO balks at progress

#150

Post by GoatInGrey »

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #149
crazygringo wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about people wanting to keep it in moats. It's about China being expansionist, actively preparing to invade Taiwan, and generally becoming an increasing military threat that does not respect the national integrity of other states. The US is fine with other countries having AI if the countries "play nice" with others. Nobody is limiting GPU's in France or Thailand. This is very specific to China's behavior an…

>It's about China being expansionist, actively preparing to invade Taiwan, and generally becoming an increasing military threat that does not respect the national integrity of other states. Remove the word Taiwan and you are describing the US. >It's about China being expansionist US has been doing that since their inception as a country. Are you telling me the USs 750 foreign military bases located in at least 80 for…

But the US doesn't imprison me for criticizing the government, or being Muslim.
Post reply on HN