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Google is using AI to censor independent websites like mine

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Re: Google is using AI to censor independent websites like mine

#141

Post by tndibona »

sumtechguy wrote: post #136
tndibona wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see your point, data is no good without actions and vice versa. Initially, I thought google couldn't possibly compete with perplexity because they are building a company from the ground up sans the surveillance ad-network. If you skim the article this thread is about, It seems google is basically headed to create a monopoly on the answers being dished out to search queries. I.e, if they know the answer they'll gene…

> I think we are in the middle of this transformation. Totally. Had a bit to think on my second point. Lets say I used to do something like 'who was the king of england in 1732'. That would in the past may lead me thru at least 3 websites. All serving ads. Now google can have that above the fold. They will have some ad's on the side like they always did. But I have the thing I want. I am probably not going to drill o…

So if I take both your points - 1. Google will have to eat it's own lunch in order to force this change. 2. They will also have to skim down their Ad space as there will just be less content real estate to place ads when the way forward is an AI style Q&A type search.

Google will have pivot, and trim its bloat to effectuate this change. This will be at the expense of "Maximising shareholder value"?

Re: Google is using AI to censor independent websites like mine

#142

Post by renegat0x0 »

nilirl wrote: post #71

The whole argument hinges on one claim: We were censored not because of content but because of who we are. Strongest evidence in support: Drop in traffic coincided with google algorithm update. Biggest lack of evidence: Nothing that shows it's because of who they are and not their content. Author defended their content by pointing out the cost and labor that goes into making their content. Was the content really auth…

The web isn't what it was 10 or 15 years ago. Back then, you could stumble across countless useful and unique websites on just about any topic—travel included.

Today, it's different. I do think Google played a major role in shrinking the visibility of the independent web. If Google only shows 300 links per search (30 pages x 10 results), anything beyond that effectively doesn't exist for most users.

Some might argue that only the top few results matter, but I disagree. For broad topics like "video games," "war," or "love," you'd expect there to be thousands of worthwhile links—not just the same recycled content from YouTube, TikTok, Reddit, or SEO-heavy content farms.

As a side project, I run a hobby web crawler to explore what's still out there. That's where my perspective comes from regarding the current state of the open web:

https://github.com/rumca-js/Internet-Places-Database

Re: Google is using AI to censor independent websites like mine

#143

Post by rsync »

helsinkiandrew wrote: post #50
blinding-streak wrote: post #25

> As one Google executive recently explained: “Organizing information is clearly a trillion-dollar opportunity, but a trillion dollars is not cool anymore. What’s cool is a quadrillion dollars.” This uncited, anonymous quote sounds very made up. Cursory search couldn't find anything like this. Regardless, while the article makes some good points, it is also dripping with entitlement. Google gave you incredible moneti…

> This uncited, anonymous quote sounds very made up. Cursory search couldn't find anything like this. Quote is from Noam Shazeer (of transformer fame) in the Dwarkesh Podcast: https://www.dwarkesh.com/p/jeff-dean-and-noam-shazeer

This kind of thinking is a cancer.

The paperclip optimizers are already here - they were always with us.

Re: Google is using AI to censor independent websites like mine

#144

Post by [deleted] »

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #11
fidotron wrote: post #5

> Google plans to use AI to consume and replace the open web. They've been boiling the frog here for a long time. The "open web" is a euphemism for the Google Chrome monoculture walled-garden-in-waiting. Google exert so much influence there that building on the web is in practice barely different than building on say iOS. You can do what you want if you don't want to make money, but if you do then you will have to pl…

>My hunch is Google never psychologically recovered from Facebook absolutely wiping out G+, and they have been on a mission to ensure nothing like that ever happens again. That's an orthogonal issue to me. IMHO, modern Google never really cared about social media platforms because it never really understood them. Otherwise it would have bought Facebook, Instagram, WhatsApp, Snapchat, Tiktok, Twitter, early on before…

[deleted]

Re: Google is using AI to censor independent websites like mine

#146

Post by [deleted] »

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #74
masklinn wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's an orthogonal issue to me. IMHO, modern Google never really cared about social media platforms because it never really understood them. Caring (or at least wanting in) and not understanding are perfectly compatible. I know for a fact that a number of old googlers are still frustrated over Google Video got stomped, and Google having to buy Youtube in the end. > Otherwise it would have bought Facebook, Instagr…

>That only works if: 1. they see it coming Zuckerberg saw them coming though. That's why he owns a social media empire now, and wants to either own or destroy Tiktok as well. Musk saw it coming with Twatter, hell, even Bezos saw it coming, that why Amazon bought Twitch. Google leadership just doesn't understand social media, otherwise they would have bought a rising platform instead of building one from scratch that…

[deleted]

Re: Google is using AI to censor independent websites like mine

#147

Post by camel_Snake »

bgwalter wrote: post #108
thedevilslawyer wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You (and others) keep using "stealing" and "robbing". I get emotions are high because of the impact of AI, but in no meaningful/legal sense is this true. Is there space for nuanced/critical discussion?

I do have a reply, but I'll save it for an article that stays on the front page so people will see it. This interesting article has dropped to page 3 within minutes.

Would you describe this new, lower ranking as censorship?

Re: Google is using AI to censor independent websites like mine

#148

Post by ipaddr »

wanderingbort wrote: post #103
nialv7 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if using algorithm to promote some information and suppress some other isn't censorship to you, then honestly your definition of censorship is narrow to the point of being useless.

Not promoting something is different than suppressing it. Censorship is active suppression. If Google was using AI to prevent independent people from accessing independent websites that would be censorship. Censorship is something that is done not simply the lack of something being done.

They literally change the algo to exclude smaller sites. That's active suppression. Promoting would be putting them on top of the "neutral" search results like they do for ads.

Re: Google is using AI to censor independent websites like mine

#149

Post by ipaddr »

thedevilslawyer wrote: post #76
bgwalter wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stealing other people's output and then cutting them off from discovery isn't a right either. Since politicians do not protect us from these criminals, we are fortunate that no one except for CEOs under the influence of cocaine wants "AI".

You (and others) keep using "stealing" and "robbing". I get emotions are high because of the impact of AI, but in no meaningful/legal sense is this true. Is there space for nuanced/critical discussion?

They come to your site record all your content and show it at the top of the page like they wrote it.

When someone does that with a book, a movie or science paper it's called stealing. What would you call it?

Re: Google is using AI to censor independent websites like mine

#150

Post by ipaddr »

camel_Snake wrote: post #147
bgwalter wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do have a reply, but I'll save it for an article that stays on the front page so people will see it. This interesting article has dropped to page 3 within minutes.

Would you describe this new, lower ranking as censorship?

Yes.
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