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Rules for Negotiating a Job Offer (2016)

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Re: Rules for Negotiating a Job Offer (2016)

#141

Post by izacus »

bdangubic wrote: post #119
bluGill wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

at my company the dollars are what they are - take it or leave it. However you can often get an extra week of paid vacation if you ask. You don't eken have to know it is exactly what we can give - the hiring manager wants you and has been told $x by hr but know vacation is an option and will offer it if you just don't say yes instantly.

I would NEVER work for a company where dollars are what they are - that is fucking mcdonald’s and I would in passing tell everyone their employer is either financially insolvent or a sweatshop. jesus!

I think they're doing just fine without you then. Don't seem very sorry either :P

Re: Rules for Negotiating a Job Offer (2016)

#142

Post by dockerd »

jaggederest wrote: post #112
parpfish wrote: post #65

I wish I could take this advice, but my imposter syndrome is just too strong and you cant just turn it off with logical explanations. By the time I get an offer, I already feel like I’m already uncomfortable about all the bragging I’ve had to do to hype myself up. Asking for more in a negotiation is just a recipe for even worse guilt during the onboarding process (which is already a fraught time for feeling like an i…

The simple thing I tell people to do who are uncomfortable with more complex negotiation is, just before you're about to accept the offer, just ask if they can increase it any. Just straight up say "Is there any room to increase this offer?" If they say no, just accept it. If not, let them increase it, then accept that increased offer. I've gotten an increase at a significant majority of companies doing this and it's…

How many different companies have you worked for?

Re: Rules for Negotiating a Job Offer (2016)

#143

Post by templarchamp »

hyperadvanced wrote: post #83
Jcampuzano2 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would someone not then just tell every recruiter/company they are interviewing with that they already have offers are are in the pipeline at other companies even if they don't. We've heard nowadays how hard it is to even get to the interview for many companies so theres probably plenty of candidates who do not have many other offers prepared or even close to prepared. Another issue is timing. Theres been times wh…

Presumably there’s a karmic payoff for this, or someone at X company knows someone at Y who can tell them whether or not you’re actually in the pipeline or have received an offer. Perhaps there’s an element of bluffing or calling bluffs in all of this.

It is a labor law violation to disclose such info.

Re: Rules for Negotiating a Job Offer (2016)

#144

Post by Aeolun »

magneticnorth wrote: post #46
Aeolun wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Me too. It was utterly bizarre. Spent 6 month looking for a job, with I don’t know how many failed interviews, then I got one offer for a 6 month contract, and suddenly the next two companies I interviewed with were falling over themselves to give me a permanent one. I just do not see how that works. There’s no logical reason for it.

In addition to your (presumably positive-enough) interview performance that the later company has themselves, they also have a "hire" recommendation from an entire other interview loop at a different company. That's a strong signal, and probably puts you ahead of most people interviewing at the later company, who only have the one set of positive feedback.

That’s theoretically true, but the only proof they have of that is the 5 or so words I uttered saying “I have a different offer”. Why should those 5 words make all the difference. You could say them without any offer at all and suddenly get the job?

Re: Rules for Negotiating a Job Offer (2016)

#145

Post by naniwaduni »

Aeolun wrote: post #144
magneticnorth wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In addition to your (presumably positive-enough) interview performance that the later company has themselves, they also have a "hire" recommendation from an entire other interview loop at a different company. That's a strong signal, and probably puts you ahead of most people interviewing at the later company, who only have the one set of positive feedback.

That’s theoretically true, but the only proof they have of that is the 5 or so words I uttered saying “I have a different offer”. Why should those 5 words make all the difference. You could say them without any offer at all and suddenly get the job?

Surprisingly, most people are not in fact lying most of the time.

(Also, in practice, there's supporting evidence like being able to spout off credible minor details that yes, are still easy to bullshit but again, most people usually aren't lying.)

Re: Rules for Negotiating a Job Offer (2016)

#146

Post by mystifyingpoi »

palata wrote: post #48

I looked for resources a few years ago and found a post by a software engineer talking about "Fearless Salary Negotiation" [1]. The engineer said: "it's a small book, cost me around 40 bucks which were immediately compensated by the fact that I managed to negotiate a higher salary". I wanted to ask for a raise: I had been working in that startup for 4 years and had never had a raise. I thought "if that book helps me…

Haha, I love it. It's incredible how tables turn once you submit your resignation. I was being outsourced and my boss declined even the smallest raise, saying that his client would have to raise the payment as well, and I cannot skip him as the middleman. So I resigned and found another job. The next day client reached out to me and asked if I want to skip the middleman, because suddenly it's fine and there are no contractual problems. That would probably mean like a 40% raise at the time. I was tempted, but it was too late.

Re: Rules for Negotiating a Job Offer (2016)

#147

Post by packetslave »

Cerium wrote: post #13
soneca wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which rules would be different in particular, you think?

The information landscape has changed a bit - several large states now require posting clear salary bands, which many companies comply with in good faith. Some like Netflix post something useless (eg: "The range for this role is $100,000 - $720,000").

Netflix is a weird case, in that they let new hires pick the mix of stock vs. cash in their total compensation. Since the CA law requires posting the cash salary in the job offer, it really can be that wide of a range.

Re: Rules for Negotiating a Job Offer (2016)

#148

Post by ghaff »

neilv wrote: post #91
hyperadvanced wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Presumably there’s a karmic payoff for this, or someone at X company knows someone at Y who can tell them whether or not you’re actually in the pipeline or have received an offer. Perhaps there’s an element of bluffing or calling bluffs in all of this.

I like karma, but wouldn't checking have the appearance of illegal collusion between the companies? For example, would it look like they were price-fixing? "Oh, your honor, I was only checking whether they had an offer. We totally weren't discussing how we'd not raise our offers, with the goal of suppressing wages."

I mean, that sounds like a level of due dilegence that a lot of companies are unlikely to follow. I suspect that most don't even check the references that you give them.

Re: Rules for Negotiating a Job Offer (2016)

#149

Post by ghaff »

whatshisface wrote: post #92
hardwaregeek wrote: post #89

With most tech career advice on the internet, I would check to see if it was written before 2022. If so, I'd take it with a grain of salt. I wrote tech advice in the ZIRP times. It was a very different market. Negotiation is still a valid tactic but there's a lot more to lose and a lot fewer offers than in 2021.

Negotiation isn't a tactic, it's the basic thing you are doing.

Depends on your position. I was employed but the company was going down the tubes when I got my last job through a connection. I didn't really negotiate and the one thing I would have liked to have negotiated (paid time off) was made clear was not on the table even before I said anything. And the offer was not FAANG levels but was incredibly good relative to what I was making.

Re: Rules for Negotiating a Job Offer (2016)

#150

Post by mcv »

silisili wrote: post #68
garciasn wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every single time I’ve been job searching (10x) I’ve always had 2-3 offers on the line simultaneously; I honestly assumed this was the norm.

Has that been recently? I've read the market has been brutal lately, but I haven't had to look myself, thankfully.

For me, it was. Couldn't find anything for 4 months, and suddenly I had 3 offers. It often works out like that. It's as if companies suddenly smell you've become desirable or something.
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