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Tesla Hate Is Making Insurance More Expensive for Owners

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141–150 of 229 posts

Re: Tesla Hate Is Making Insurance More Expensive for Owners

#141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Last I checked Henry Ford was still dead and the current owners of Ford are not known to be Nazis. Just in the last week Musk reposted "Stalin, Hitler and Mao didn’t murder millions of people. Their public sector workers did." I would rather not be getting a car in return for a sizeable donation to someone who is spreading that kind of rhetoric.

Just thinking and putting some thoughts out. I guess the question is when does accountability stop? If a company and its descendant employees and products are built on an evil foundation and benefit from it, how do we rectify as a society? Ford is hardly alone here, many German, Japanese, and American companies were built on wartime atrocities and exist today from that previous goodwill. If the malignant founder is d…

I agree, and I've long thought that there is no such thing as a clean dollar. I could donate $100 to an animal shelter, and some % of that will eventually make its way into evil hands. But I'd make that trade-off because the money is being used more for good than bad, and the bad part is largely out of my control.

Musk's wealth is however causing very direct and obvious harm to causes I care about, and he uses his platform of 100M+ followers to spread hateful views which now permeate every conversation. I am tired of him being relevant. There are many alternatives to Tesla so it is easy enough to not give him money.

I also take a forward-facing view. I can't change what people's past dollars were spent on. Instead I care about what my dollars be spent on after I give them to a company. I buy Porsche cars today even though their founder was a Nazi and the company is still majority-owned by the Porsche family. But their founder is dead, and today's Porsche has strongly disavowed Nazi views. Seems my money mostly goes toward developing cool cars while the owners stay out of politics.

Re: Tesla Hate Is Making Insurance More Expensive for Owners

#143
post #18

Might effect new buyers decisions I guess, but since about 99% of Tesla's were sold to green, left-leaning buyers, before the Elon hate-fest, I am not sure how targeting that group of people for your hatred is helping any "cause".

Protests and ethics and capitalism and products and politics are more complicated than that. If collateral damage or somehow hurting anybody in "your" half of The Two Groups (which is a faulty premise to begin with) is ruled out, you're wiping out nearly all opinions and protest. Things just aren't that simple (though it's convenient to pretend they are when it lets us point a finger at the enemy out-group - look at…

[flagged]

Re: Tesla Hate Is Making Insurance More Expensive for Owners

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He is suggesting the opposite. Attacking every company run by someone you disagree with politically is a recipe for not being able to participate in society in any meaningful way. Musk's views are quite normal and are shared by people involved in every company and institution out there. Are you going to boycott them all? These boycotts only work as isolated, selective outrage. It is the same with countries. If you wa…

>> Musk's views are quite normal Citation please

a majority of the American people voted for the guy who explicitly and repeatedly campaigned with him. that's a pretty solid citation.

Re: Tesla Hate Is Making Insurance More Expensive for Owners

#145
post #113
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole point is new buyers.. People are protesting Musk. Something like 75% of Musk's current wealth comes from Tesla stock. Tesla stock is going down.. so it is helping the cause

He's got less than 20% of Tesla now, but he owns nearly half of SpaceX... bet you he'd be so so sooooooooo much richer if that went public too

With rational investors I doubt it. Space launch market size is like 20 billion. One launch is 70 million and they had 133 of them in 2024. Times two (currently at half market share) this would be 18 billion.

That does not take into account that they are increasing the market size themselves with Starlink.

And with Starlink it remains to be seen if that can be profitable. I doubt it. The Starlink satellites deorbit every 5 years and need to be replaced (CapEx+++).

This is compared to the trillion+ EV market.

Re: Tesla Hate Is Making Insurance More Expensive for Owners

#146
post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Protests and ethics and capitalism and products and politics are more complicated than that. If collateral damage or somehow hurting anybody in "your" half of The Two Groups (which is a faulty premise to begin with) is ruled out, you're wiping out nearly all opinions and protest. Things just aren't that simple (though it's convenient to pretend they are when it lets us point a finger at the enemy out-group - look at…

[flagged]

Please read the entire sentence when you quote something:

> That is not to say the opposite - that I think all anti-Tesla hatred/actions are justified. I'm just refuting your opinion specifically.

Re: Tesla Hate Is Making Insurance More Expensive for Owners

#147
post #18

Might effect new buyers decisions I guess, but since about 99% of Tesla's were sold to green, left-leaning buyers, before the Elon hate-fest, I am not sure how targeting that group of people for your hatred is helping any "cause".

Nah. Insurance is based on the numbers, and Tesla is a shitty company to have financial liability to fix. There’s no parts, few shops, and lots of stuff to get stuck with. A friend had a rental for 4 months when the panoramic sunroof cracked on his Tesla. The vandalism isn’t computed in yet, and will immediately resulted in dropped coverage. If the Feds label it as terrorism, insurance generally excludes riot and ter…

.

Re: Tesla Hate Is Making Insurance More Expensive for Owners

#148
post #3

This article provides no causation between 'Tesla hate' and insurance costs. The only factual claim is that Tesla insurance premiums rose 30% in 2024, and cost to insure is 25% higher than a Mercedes A-class. But a quick internet search shows that 2022 MSRPs for those cars were $47k and $34k respectively, a 32% difference.

this is probably because teslas are 1. poorly built, and 2. not very repairable. they're crappily constructed cars, honestly, probably none more than the cybertruck. like whistlindiesel found a washer resting on a piece of duct tape. insane. fisher price ass cars. just as importantly, get into a crash and they're very tough to fix, before considering the low availability of parts and common service wait times.

Re: Tesla Hate Is Making Insurance More Expensive for Owners

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah. Insurance is based on the numbers, and Tesla is a shitty company to have financial liability to fix. There’s no parts, few shops, and lots of stuff to get stuck with. A friend had a rental for 4 months when the panoramic sunroof cracked on his Tesla. The vandalism isn’t computed in yet, and will immediately resulted in dropped coverage. If the Feds label it as terrorism, insurance generally excludes riot and ter…

.

> the world's best crash avoidance system

Interesting claim. Can you share any research or source into this?

Re: Tesla Hate Is Making Insurance More Expensive for Owners

#150
post #18

Might effect new buyers decisions I guess, but since about 99% of Tesla's were sold to green, left-leaning buyers, before the Elon hate-fest, I am not sure how targeting that group of people for your hatred is helping any "cause".

Nah. Insurance is based on the numbers, and Tesla is a shitty company to have financial liability to fix. There’s no parts, few shops, and lots of stuff to get stuck with. A friend had a rental for 4 months when the panoramic sunroof cracked on his Tesla. The vandalism isn’t computed in yet, and will immediately resulted in dropped coverage. If the Feds label it as terrorism, insurance generally excludes riot and ter…

The problem with Tesla is they used financial engineering to get where they are today, and that cycle eventually catches up to you.

Enshittification is a real thing, and happens because benefits were front-loaded through ponzi (in this case backed by money printing and the public market retirements that must rebalance based on S&P or other indexes).

There are also higher risks with 'licensing' a Tesla. Both to society as a whole, and to the owners themselves. Licensing isn't owning, and you get what you pay for.

Few of the people who choose to get a Tesla actually think about what they are doing aside from their own ego, which is actively supporting un-American ideals.

How-so?

A Tesla is not a car, it is a sensor/node based computer that is networked and connected that performs the functions of a car.

A networked computer with many sensors is part of a mass distributed network called "Remote Sensing Networks" or RSNs.

The short-term profit on money isn't in building the car. It is in selling the data that has been collected and aggregated to the highest bidder, while getting you to pay for your own enslavement to such willfully provided subscription data.

Every time you see a Tesla while driving, whether it is on or off, the Tesla logs you and your passengers face, biometrics, behavior, location, history, travel, and other hints that may be visible including EM following a master data-management strategy that is built on big-tech primitives at their data center. This includes conversations or more intimate settings which have already leaked to the general internet (in some cases).

It is illegal for anyone to film, and distribute film of others, and record conversation without their explicit and specific consent, let alone such other aspects of personal data, where it contains everywhere you go, what you do, even in your own backyard or within your garage (home), or your neighbors (where consent is not given). Yet this is what Tesla is doing through complacent consent, and coercion (corruption by dependency in sunk cost/function).

A Tesla is not the only RSN, your cell phone does this, your media players (Roku) and Smart TVs do this. Your laptops, modern OS (Windows), and too many other devices to count do this. When profit is guaranteed, monopolists seek coercive control, and information is power.

If you have these, you have consented to have a digital soldier mediating in every aspect of your life whether you know it or not. Even though they didn't tell you what they were doing. They were not required to specifically say what and how they used that data, and they defined it broadly and ambiguously. Dis-aggregation of Alarm, and Separation of Concerns.

That is how the banality of evil (complacency) becomes the radical evil (Nazi's).

What does that open the door to or allow?

Abuse, Coercion, Arbitrary Discrimination, Loss of some things that become everything. These are the same abuses that inspired the constitution's third amendment, and what led us to join the War for self and others during WW2.

We are repeating what lead up to the American Revolution, and because so many people have wilfully blinded themselves they can't see the consequences of their actions while they actively participate towards definite systems failures, mindlessly.

"No Soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the Owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law."

Implicit in this is that there remains a rule of law, which has mostly failed.

I really pity the people who have such little awareness that they go and buy a Tesla. It is like waving the communist/fascist flag which is statism, for all to see... we're American. "Yes, but what kind of American".

This has happened before, and it is too late to stop it from happening again.

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