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Software engineering job openings hit five-year low?

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Re: Software engineering job openings hit five-year low?

#141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember that employee cost is usually estimated at twice their salary.

Does that scale neatly with salary? I would expect it not to, with things like benefits and other costs being relatively fixed regardless of salary

I assume people who are paid more also typically receive better benefits

Re: Software engineering job openings hit five-year low?

#142
The charts show software dev gaining more jobs under the COVID demand and stimulus swing, and then losing more as those went away and monetary policy got tighter than even it had been even before the COVID stimulus.

The easiest explanation for the whole chart is "Software dev is more reactive to the monetary policy environment than most other industries, because more of it is funded by new capital investment -- whether VC money or otherwise -- instead of ongoing operations of stable firms compared to most other industries."

Trying to add other explanations is fun, but there's not a lot of evidence for any of them, or even that more explanations are needed.

Re: Software engineering job openings hit five-year low?

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our company just let go of all our remote LATAM hires. We paid high end in their LCOL areas. They were somewhere between ok and not good. Felt like we got about what we paid for - their cost was about 50% of a US dev. They were as productive as a low end US dev, so in some cases ok value but since hiring low performers tends to hurt a team overall they weren’t worth it. We’re a mid range company (decent cash comp, no…

>Felt like we got about what we paid for This is the usual ebb and flow of offshoring in the tech industry that's been going on since the 90s. There has never been a scalable arbitrage for tech talent by going over to another geo, and there won't be one in the foreseeable future. What US HCoL talent gets paid is unfortunately the fair and natural market rate for that caliber of talent, at least if you need to hire mo…

EPAM systems employs 65,000 people and has revenues of $5bn a year.

Re: Software engineering job openings hit five-year low?

#145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is so backwards it’s incredible. If H1Bs were so destructive to the software industry, why would the software industry, which has the highest prevalence of H1Bs, be the industry with the highest growth in salaries for basically the past 2 decades? Also, the idea that eliminating H1Bs will bring more jobs makes absolutely no sense. If a company is asked to eliminate all their H1B positions, what do you think is m…

I believe the American public’s appetite to disincentivize and tax the American companies that ship jobs overseas while simultaneously benefiting from the protection, infrastructure and US government contracts directly or indirectly will only increase in the coming years.

Easy to tax physical goods, hard to tax "underpaid" service work.

Is DeepMind an American company? It's owned by Google, but it was founded in, and is still HQed in, the UK, but has offices worldwide. How much appetite do you recon Canada, France, Germany, and the UK have for America's trillion-dollar-club at this point?

Now sure, you could demand any corporations selling in the US, even if not based there, hand over payroll etc. documents and then tax them at whatever the multiplier is to go from that country's salary to US salaries… if you don't mind that means some countries are banned by existing privacy laws from doing business with you, or that even this is easily gamed, or that American exceptionalism is increasingly overstaying its welcome.

Re: Software engineering job openings hit five-year low?

#146
post #60

FRED wants the implication to be AI related, but it seems pretty clear that all/most of this decline is related to their interest rate policies creating a raft of bullshit companies funded by too many dollars chasing ever more far-fetched returns...

And add to that many companies moving their IT department to low cost countries.

Re: Software engineering job openings hit five-year low?

#147
The graph is very interesting! The number of Indeed openings looks like it's basically leveled off at the initial early covid number over the last year; it's not rising, but at least it's not falling anymore. That seems like pretty optimistic news for developers! Total compensation is still pretty high, I hear. And it seems likely that if humans aren't replaced wholesale by AGI, the opportunities for building valuable new software are likely to increase a lot over the next few years.

Smaller teams and more bootstrapping (as opposed to venture-funded rapid growth) seems likely to reduce the reliance on recruiters who are a plague on the industry, with few exceptions.

On the other hand, maybe a lot of tasks you could previously get a lot of leverage on with a simple Perl script will just be done directly by LLMs. Not if they're customer-facing, maybe, but in cases where you just need to get some data in a different format or something.

Re: Software engineering job openings hit five-year low?

#148

>I’m sure that LLMs are a leading cause of the fall in software developer job postings I can't agree with the conclusion. I can come with tens of examples of when using AI doesn't work. Also, software engineering means much more than writing code.

the quote doesn't state what you intend to refute.

Re: Software engineering job openings hit five-year low?

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our company just let go of all our remote LATAM hires. We paid high end in their LCOL areas. They were somewhere between ok and not good. Felt like we got about what we paid for - their cost was about 50% of a US dev. They were as productive as a low end US dev, so in some cases ok value but since hiring low performers tends to hurt a team overall they weren’t worth it. We’re a mid range company (decent cash comp, no…

>Felt like we got about what we paid for This is the usual ebb and flow of offshoring in the tech industry that's been going on since the 90s. There has never been a scalable arbitrage for tech talent by going over to another geo, and there won't be one in the foreseeable future. What US HCoL talent gets paid is unfortunately the fair and natural market rate for that caliber of talent, at least if you need to hire mo…

I can raise two points to disprove this - I'm East Euro, but have worked with people from all over the globe in all kinds of companies.

First, my experience with devs at mid level companies is that the average dev ranges from competent (as in, can work within an existing framework to accomplish tasks), to incompetent (cannot do the same consistently), with there being a top 10-20% who are truly good (able to deliver complex high quality software from a blank sheet, capable of working on complex existing systems meaningfully etc.). This applies to all companies (including ones in the US).

Second, at high level companies, there's lots of European talent (usually in West Europe) - these people are as good as their US peers (by definition, and usually has been my experience), but make less than what you would take home in a mid level US company.

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