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Why is the American diet so deadly?

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Re: Why is the American diet so deadly?

#141

Post by resource_waste »

deeviant wrote: post #115
resource_waste wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Not enough fiber (fruits, veg). I'm not sure why people think fiber is great. Yes it pushes things through. Yes there are bacteria that eat it. So does other food. But it also makes you go poop more often, which is bad for your body. I mostly eat meats and relatively low fiber food. I don't track it closely, so occasionally I'll eat corn and it passes through. --- My point: "Why fiber?" Actually prove that the gener…

Why fiber? Because a diet rich in fiber has been repeatedly found to significantly reduce the chance of early death? https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S026156142... https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25552267/ https://translational-medicine.biomedcentral.com/articles/10... (You can find many more) Literally thousands of studies with one of the clearest results in nutritional science, frankly.

The first 2 links have no data available. I only could read the third.

Self reported. Oh boy. No control. haha.

So... is this not science? Its induction?

Since fiber correlates with healthy food, I believe that is what we are seeing. Where as eating sugar and oil has no fiber. However its not like we are having a meat eater compared directly.

I come from chemistry, not sociology. The replication crisis has been kind to me, and terrible for biology and beyond.

Re: Why is the American diet so deadly?

#142

Post by rawgabbit »

verteu wrote: post #53

For me, the biggest mystery is this: If obesity is caused by poor diet, why doesn't dieting work long-term? https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/when-dieting-doesnt-work... > 121 eligible trials with 21 942 patients were included and reported on 14 named diets and three control diets ... At 12 months the effects on weight reduction and improvements in cardiovascular risk factors largely disappear.

I fixed your question. If obesity is caused by poor [nutrition], why doesn't [weight loss programs] work long-term?

You answered your own question. Weight loss programs do not work long term because only healthy nutrition does. I have been downvoted here before, but I would argue that healthy nutrition is expensive. It is cheaper in terms of time and cost to consume quick meals full of carbs, sugars, chemical additives that wrecks our bodies. It not only takes money but also time to cook meals that are heart healthy, prevent diabetes, and provides healthy fats/proteins/carbs.

Re: Why is the American diet so deadly?

#143

Post by cratermoon »

dukeyukey wrote: post #11
cratermoon wrote: post #5

Why? ultra-processed food.

Then you need to explain why the Japanese diet, also filled with ultra-processed food, is vastly healthier.

> filled with ultra-processed food Bold assertion. Examples?

> is vastly healthier

Also a bold assertion. Citation?

Re: Why is the American diet so deadly?

#144

Post by tayo42 »

CharlieDigital wrote: post #129
tayo42 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Fiber keeps you feeling satiated for longer. Does this actually work for anyone? I eat these high fiber foods that get suggested and i never feel full for hours.

You have to combine fiber with protein and fat. Fiber fills you up now by taking up physical volume. Try eating the equivalent of 200 calories of broc vs 200 calories of bread or pasta. The problem is that your body can't digest fiber so the digestive system moves it along quickly! Fat and protein extends the feeling of satiation by turning off the hormonal signals for hunger. If you eat an apple, try it with two tab…

That is adding so many calories though? Adding the 2 tablespoons of peanut butter is another 200 calories.

An example, im targeting 2200-2400 calories. with 3 600 calorie meals (which tbh is pretty hard to do 7 or 800 is more likely) , there isn't that much buffer to add stuff like thhat.

Re: Why is the American diet so deadly?

#145

Post by CharlieDigital »

tayo42 wrote: post #144
CharlieDigital wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have to combine fiber with protein and fat. Fiber fills you up now by taking up physical volume. Try eating the equivalent of 200 calories of broc vs 200 calories of bread or pasta. The problem is that your body can't digest fiber so the digestive system moves it along quickly! Fat and protein extends the feeling of satiation by turning off the hormonal signals for hunger. If you eat an apple, try it with two tab…

That is adding so many calories though? Adding the 2 tablespoons of peanut butter is another 200 calories. An example, im targeting 2200-2400 calories. with 3 600 calorie meals (which tbh is pretty hard to do 7 or 800 is more likely) , there isn't that much buffer to add stuff like thhat.

Is it? An apple is only ~100 calories. 300 calories. You could make it a full meal by adding 500 calories of chicken or beans/lentils + rice to get to your 800 target and that's a very solid meal. A whole can of tuna in water is only ~200-250 calories and another option to add more protein.

Re: Why is the American diet so deadly?

#146

Post by jghn »

rawgabbit wrote: post #142
verteu wrote: post #53

For me, the biggest mystery is this: If obesity is caused by poor diet, why doesn't dieting work long-term? https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/when-dieting-doesnt-work... > 121 eligible trials with 21 942 patients were included and reported on 14 named diets and three control diets ... At 12 months the effects on weight reduction and improvements in cardiovascular risk factors largely disappear.

I fixed your question. If obesity is caused by poor [nutrition], why doesn't [weight loss programs] work long-term? You answered your own question. Weight loss programs do not work long term because only healthy nutrition does. I have been downvoted here before, but I would argue that healthy nutrition is expensive. It is cheaper in terms of time and cost to consume quick meals full of carbs, sugars, chemical additiv…

> Weight loss programs do not work long term because only healthy nutrition does

That's not entirely true, although it is a big factor. As an anecdotal example, there was a period of my life where nearly 100% of my diet was fast food: there was a McD's, BK, and Wendy's in my neighborhood. I did this part out of laziness, and part because Supersize Me annoyed me. In contrast to Supersize Me I dilligently tracked my caloric intake from those meals and intentionally limited things to be affect the changes I wanted to see in my weight.

Net result? I lost weight until I achieved my target, and then I was able to stay steady.

Would I recommend this plan? No. I was focusing purely on weight and I'm sure there were many other suboptimal knock on effects for my body. But people act like it is physically impossible to lose weight via pure caloric deficit and/or by consuming fast food. That's not true.

Re: Why is the American diet so deadly?

#147

Post by orev »

tonymet wrote: post #49
Workaccount2 wrote: post #20

I think a big part of the problem is that even prepared foods are packed with garbage. There are a lot of Americans who can't/don't cook mainly for time reasons, and instead eat lots of prepared foods, whether that be from restaurants, shops, or grocery stores. If you are not cooking it from scratch yourself, it is almost guaranteed to be brimming with fat, salt, and sugar. This is true regardless of the source. Whet…

When asked why restaurant food tasted so good, Anthony Bourdain chuckled and quipped that "everything you are served begins and finishes with a stick of butter". People would gasp if they prepared that food for themselves. When I finish a steak with 2 tbsp of butter it tastes luxurious, and any respectable steakhouse is finishing a steak with a stick of butter and garnishes it with an ice cream scoop of butter.

He also said that restaurant vegetables taste good because they cook them with sugar.

Re: Why is the American diet so deadly?

#148

Post by plorkyeran »

anovikov wrote: post #92
jayd16 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Short of a kegeraror, one can develop a taste for tea or black coffee. As long as you don't put anything in it, it's basically zero calorie and trivial to prepare.

Overdoing on coffee, especially being very tall, is quite dangerous for one's heart...

It is not worse than getting the same amount of caffeine from diet soda, which is the point of comparison here.

Re: Why is the American diet so deadly?

#149

Post by deeviant »

resource_waste wrote: post #141
deeviant wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why fiber? Because a diet rich in fiber has been repeatedly found to significantly reduce the chance of early death? https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S026156142... https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25552267/ https://translational-medicine.biomedcentral.com/articles/10... (You can find many more) Literally thousands of studies with one of the clearest results in nutritional science, frankly.

The first 2 links have no data available. I only could read the third. Self reported. Oh boy. No control. haha. So... is this not science? Its induction? Since fiber correlates with healthy food, I believe that is what we are seeing. Where as eating sugar and oil has no fiber. However its not like we are having a meat eater compared directly. I come from chemistry, not sociology. The replication crisis has been kind…

Something prevented you from clicking the clearly marked link to the full paper? I don't feel your approach is very... rigorous.

Re: Why is the American diet so deadly?

#150

Post by [deleted] »

bluedino wrote: post #68
Workaccount2 wrote: post #20

I think a big part of the problem is that even prepared foods are packed with garbage. There are a lot of Americans who can't/don't cook mainly for time reasons, and instead eat lots of prepared foods, whether that be from restaurants, shops, or grocery stores. If you are not cooking it from scratch yourself, it is almost guaranteed to be brimming with fat, salt, and sugar. This is true regardless of the source. Whet…

> There are a lot of Americans who can't/don't cook mainly for time reasons In that sense, the 10% of people who aren't that busy, should be cooking. Very few people are that busy. It's just not a priority. Americans spend an astonishing 4 hours and 37 minutes looking at our phones every day.

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