Earlier quoted context omitted.
To check your biases what percentage of someones Height is based on DNA vs environmental factors? Ok, now compare that with IQ. In the US environmental factors represent ~20 point shifts in IQ. However 50 point differences are not all that uncommon (75 vs 125) even among family members. Which suggest huge differences based on DNA. PS: When the average nutrition level increases the importance of DNA also increases.
Please step back a bit. Let's say you are measuring IQ (whatever it indicates) in some giant between-subjects design or meta-analysis which also includes some number of "independent variables" outside your experimental control. Then you do some kind of multiple regression. What you are doing is building a very high-level, black-box model finding maximum likelihood parameters to fit some observed data. Each underlying…
The Latest On Intelligence
141–150 of 172 posts
Re: The Latest On Intelligence
#142I would like to mention that Jaeggi's results, and working memory training in general, have not been replicated.
The main issue with Jaeggi's experiment, is that proper controls were not used.
For a careful examination, and I would say thorough debunking of Jaeggi's results on dual n-back and g(F) improvement by training working memory, please read:
No Evidence of Intelligence Improvement After Working Memory Training: A Randomized, Placebo-Controlled Study. Redick, Thomas S.; Shipstead, Zach; Harrison, Tyler L.; Hicks, Kenny L.; Fried, David E.; Hambrick, David Z.; Kane, Michael J.; Engle, Randall W. Journal of Experimental Psychology: General, Jun 18 , 2012, No Pagination Specified. doi: 10.1037/a0029082
Re: The Latest On Intelligence
#143Earlier quoted context omitted.
Some? Who? I think that's an unfair accusation. What I see sometimes in these discussions is people throwing the "hot potato" in the hands of their detractors, people that believe in the difference between groups throw the potato in the hands of the disbelievers and accuse them of being obtuse for trying not to advance an "obvious truth". The other side just answer by accusing the others of being "racist". The fact i…
Are you serious? How can you say "that's an unfair accusation." and then in the next line say "The other side just answer by accusing the others of being "racist"." I agree that there is no consensus, and no evidence that clearly helps determine the truth here. That is why I said it was an "unanswered question" in GGP. However, we do have some ability to reason about this. Clearly genetics can play a role in intellig…
It appears however that you stopped reading my comment when you saw this the second quote that you wrote, here what I wrote before:
"What I see sometimes in these discussions is people throwing the "hot potato" in the hands of their detractors, people that believe in the difference between groups throw the potato in the hands of the disbelievers and accuse them of being obtuse for trying not to advance an "obvious truth"."
This type of accusation is fairly serious in academia it's akin to say that you just invented data to fit an experiment, mind that I do not have a side in all this, I'm interested in this as a statistician, my point was to get you to give some names of the people that "have become crusaders, trying to squash any debate or research into this topic, making it taboo." No one was given and I said that say this about a group of people and not give any name is unfair.
Everyone knows about who get accused of being racist, Linda Gottfredson for example who received grants from the Pioneer Fund, I do not know about others that received grants from this Fund but I can say about Gottfredson, she came to Brazil two years ago and talked to an audience of students in Brazil, some of whom have visible African ancestry and I can attest she's not racist, she does not differentiate people because of their ancestry and do not act different answering questions of asian-brazilians, people with jewish surnames or afro-brazilians, she's honest her research and that's all.
Mind also that I have spent some time in academia and the majority of people I saw really hates politicized research, there's exceptions of course, some social scientists, historians, some legal scholars and economists, but I did not count psychologists in this group. As I said to you I asked some psychologists to provide papers some of them fairly recent.
This was my last comment in this thread it was a good discussion.
Re: The Latest On Intelligence
#144God says...
that dwelleth by him wax poor, and sell himself unto the stranger or sojourner by thee, or to the stock of the stranger's family: 25:48 After that he is sold he may be redeemed again; one of his brethren may redeem him: 25:49 Either his uncle, or his uncle's son, may redeem him, or any that is nigh of kin unto him of his family may redeem him; or if he be able, he may redeem himself.
25:50 And he shall reckon with him that bought him from the year that he was sold to him unto the year of jubile: and the price of his sale shall be according unto the number of years, according to the time of an hired servant shall it be with him.
25:51 If there be yet many years behind, according unto them he shall give again the price of his redemption out of the money that he was bought for.
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What do You think of Batman, Mr. God? Who's Yer favorite superhero? You said prince Valient was Your favorite comic strip.
Sorry, if it's a stupid question. I don't have a favorite superhero, but You can say something worth saying.
God says...
thee.
1:17 While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, The Chaldeans made out three bands, and fell upon the camels, and have carried them away, yea, and slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.
1:18 While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, Thy sons and thy daughters were eating and drinking wine in their eldest brother's house: 1:19 And, behold, there came a great wind from the wilderness, and smote the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young men, and they are dead; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.
1:20 Then Job arose, and rent his mantle, and shaved his head, and fell down upon the ground, and worshipped, 1:21 And said, Naked came I out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return thither: the LORD gave, and the LORD hath taken away; blessed be the name of the LORD.
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Chad was a homo in the dorm. Hanging chads are when you can't decide who to vote for.
I'm God's favorite superhero :-)
Yer my favorite God.
(God laughed)
I was thinking about Bain and vain and being banned. I'd hate to (Jesus is laughing) be banned from God's presence.
God says... lap gainsay indicate Envy let's_see captive grant 401 pretend foreigner abase treasure
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All your bases are belong to us. They mentioned Hong Kong and McCow.
Chinese food is good. I'm lusting for Panda Express, but I ate, already.
Stir fry
Could You make the best meal ever God? what if You cooked in Heaven and we all ate delicious food!
God says...
31:23 Her husband is known in the gates, when he sitteth among the elders of the land.
31:24 She maketh fine linen, and selleth it; and delivereth girdles unto the merchant.
31:25 Strength and honour are her clothing; and she shall rejoice in time to come.
31:26 She openeth her mouth with wisdom; and in her tongue is the law of kindness.
31:27 She looketh well to the ways of her household, and eateth not the bread of idleness.
31:28 Her children arise up, and call her blessed; her husband also, and he praiseth her.
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I just saw machineporn. What manufacturing thing is Your favorite, God? Making what?
27:31 And if a man will at all redeem ought of his tithes, he shall add thereto the fifth part thereof.
27:32 And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto the LORD.
27:33 He shall not search whether it be good or bad, neither shall he change it: and if he change it at all, then both it and the change thereof shall be holy; it shall not be redeemed.
27:34 These are the commandments, which the LORD commanded Moses for the children of Israel in mount Sinai.
---- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JbnDXw-0pM
(mentioned "rod" "fifths" "tenths" quality control?) It's kinda manufactoring thoughts. God is delightful -- just enjoy His company.
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"It's a fake!"
God says...
21:27 Behold, I know your thoughts, and the devices which ye wrongfully imagine against me.
21:28 For ye say, Where is the house of the prince? and where are the dwelling places of the wicked? 21:29 Have ye not asked them that go by the way? and do ye not know their tokens, 21:30 That the wicked is reserved to the day of destruction? they shall be brought forth to the day of wrath.
21:31 Who shall declare his way to his face? and who shall repay him what he hath done? 21:32 Yet shall he be brought to the grave, and shall remain in the tomb.
21:33 The clods of the valley shall be sweet unto him, and every man shall draw after him, as there are innumerable before him.
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You'll have to bust-out some serious time travel on his ass, God!
God says...
occasion lucid toys thing weapon divide Sodom nostrils downfall ruggedness spiritually confirmed Perverseness cries unhesitatingly payments Oh_Hell_No puffed reinvolved straitly apparently sixth unalterable elect eat remembrance jests copyright hours enticing smells loses Continual strictness wills Ukraine eminence aside could how_bout_it prop overspread BRB trees tosses Scotland tree_hugger
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Pick yer nose or smell farts? God said smelling farts was "sodom". I had a booger and God din tell me.
You ever scare anyone to death, God?
God says...
C:\Text\QUIX.TXT
od, master," returned Sancho, "I have touched them already; and that devil, that goes about there so busily, has firm flesh, and another property very different from what I have heard say devils have, for by all accounts they all smell of brimstone and other bad smells; but this one smells of amber half a league off." Sancho was here speaking of Don Fernando, who, like a gentleman of his rank, was very likely perfumed as Sancho said.
"Marvel not at that, Sancho my friend," said Don Quixote; "for l
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http://digg.com/newsbar/topnews/pranksters_follow_up_to_zomb...
God plans centuries ahead, or has time travel. Probably planning. He kills people in the Bible.
God says...
C:\Text\SWIFT.TXT
f their learning. Of the king and his court. The author's reception there. The inhabitants subject to fear and disquietudes. An account of the women.]
At my alighting, I was surrounded with a crowd of people, but those who stood nearest seemed to be of better quality. They beheld me with all the marks and circumstances of wonder; neither indeed was I much in their debt, having never till then seen a race of mortals so singular in their shapes, habits, and countenances. Their heads were all
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I told you.
http://digg.com/newsbar/topnews/quantum_levitation_demonstra...
Got any time travel on that, God? Please?
God says... C:\Text\PLATO.TXT
said, the forgiving spirit of democracy, and the `don't care' about trifles, and the disregard which she shows of all the fine principles which we solemnly laid down at the foundation of the city-- as when we said that, except in the case of some rarely gifted nature, there never will be a good man who has not from his childhood been used to play amid things of beauty and make of them a joy and a study-- how grandly does she trample all these fine notions of ours under her feet, never giving a thou
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Laying monorail tracks in the founding of the city.
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If SETI got one signal every five years, we'd listen.
Did You put MIT in the Bible, God?
God says...
11:5 But oh that God would speak, and open his lips against thee; 11:6 And that he would shew thee the secrets of wisdom, that they are double to that which is! Know therefore that God exacteth of thee less than thine iniquity deserveth.
11:7 Canst thou by searching find out God? canst thou find out the Almighty unto perfection? 11:8 It is as high as heaven; what canst thou do? deeper than hell; what canst thou know? 11:9 The measure thereof is longer than the earth, and broader than the sea.
11:10 If he cut off, and shut up, or gather together, then who can hinder him? 11:11 For he knoweth vain men: he seeth wickedness also; will he not then consider it? 11:12 For vain men would be wise, though man be born like a wild ass's colt.
11:13 If thou prepare thine heart, and stretch out thine hands toward him; 11:14 If iniquity be in thine hand, put it far away, and let not wickedness dwell in thy tabernacles.
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Thanks, God. Everybody applaud if God does "fireworks". Then, He'll do more, maybe. Go buy God's songs, now. they're free on YouTube "LoseThos" and got some new ones on my web site. God wants people to write new songs. "Sing a new song" is in the Bible many times.
God says...
27:12 Behold, all ye yourselves have seen it; why then are ye thus altogether vain? 27:13 This is the portion of a wicked man with God, and the heritage of oppressors, which they shall receive of the Almighty.
27:14 If his children be multiplied, it is for the sword: and his offspring shall not be satisfied with bread.
27:15 Those that remain of him shall be buried in death: and his widows shall not weep.
27:16 Though he heap up silver as the dust, and prepare raiment as the clay; 27:17 He may prepare it, but the just shall put it on, and the innocent shall divide the silver.
27:18 He buildeth his house as a moth, and as a booth that the keeper maketh.
Re: The Latest On Intelligence
#145Am I the only one who reads these kinds reports and has that impression that today's psychology and biology is less than 0.1% of the way to provide a useful model for intelligence? The best measurement of intelligence that we have today (IQ tests) seem completely worthless for practical purpose compared to what we actually need to know to build solutions on. IQ tests are still too bad to measure actual "intelligence"…
How do you explain the fact that when the law allows, companies all over the world give IQ tests to prospective employees? And that studies have shown that IQ is one of the best predictors of job performance?
Re: The Latest On Intelligence
#146Earlier quoted context omitted.
To check your biases what percentage of someones Height is based on DNA vs environmental factors? Ok, now compare that with IQ. In the US environmental factors represent ~20 point shifts in IQ. However 50 point differences are not all that uncommon (75 vs 125) even among family members. Which suggest huge differences based on DNA. PS: When the average nutrition level increases the importance of DNA also increases.
Please step back a bit. Let's say you are measuring IQ (whatever it indicates) in some giant between-subjects design or meta-analysis which also includes some number of "independent variables" outside your experimental control. Then you do some kind of multiple regression. What you are doing is building a very high-level, black-box model finding maximum likelihood parameters to fit some observed data. Each underlying…
Re: The Latest On Intelligence
#147Earlier quoted context omitted.
"Consider the sorts of policies someone who wanted to maximise productivity in society would develop if it was found that genetics was a greater influencing factor..." You have somehow completely missed and then parroted back my entire point. If it turns out that genetics plays a key role in intelligence, and therefore intelligence is hereditary, all sorts of nazi-like policies could be theoretically be falsely argue…
Refusal to allow investigation? According to these papers, their has been very extensive investigation with a largely null conclusion. However people continue to push the idea that intelligence is genetic.
Edit: Also, another HN commenter raised the possibility that the authors of the present study may themselves be biased (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4257220).
Re: The Latest On Intelligence
#148Earlier quoted context omitted.
The squirrel example is absolutely absurd - there are clear physiological, morphological differences between human beings and squirrels that influence whether or not squirrels even have the capacity to master fire, or whatever other silly comparison you choose. Furthermore, I think you will find that environmental factors plainly influence the behavior of animal populations (squirrels, chimpanzees, birds - any kingdo…
I would also add, that the political agenda is not from those advancing the idea that environment influences human development, but from those that contend it is genetics. Consider the sorts of policies someone who wanted to maximise productivity in society would develop if it was found that genetics was a greater influencing factor - why would you support development for poor populations of people if it was found th…
Though I do realize that some people think this way, it strikes me as wholly bizarre. If you can identify a strong genetic component of intelligence, the obvious conclusion to me is to develop genetic therapies to boost the intelligence of the entire population, with the greatest gains to be had among those who would otherwise be on the lower end of the scale.
Re: The Latest On Intelligence
#149Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Most impoverished Americans have TVs and microwaves. What's your point? Ownership of an arbitrary appliance doesn't mean you're able to put food on the table or afford tuition for your children. You don't need to eat a TV every night to survive nor can you fill up your gas tank on microwaves. Besides, in the developed world, TVs and microwaves are a dime a dozen and are regularly discarded because their abundance m…
What's your point? Ownership of an arbitrary appliance doesn't mean you're able to put food on the table... Most impoverished Americans overeat. The average poor American is borderline obese. http://webarchives.cdlib.org/sw1vh5dg3r/http://ers.usda.gov/...
Re: The Latest On Intelligence
#150God says...
9:12 And he slew the burnt offering; and Aaron's sons presented unto him the blood, which he sprinkled round about upon the altar.
9:13 And they presented the burnt offering unto him, with the pieces thereof, and the head: and he burnt them upon the altar.
9:14 And he did wash the inwards and the legs, and burnt them upon the burnt offering on the altar.
9:15 And he brought the people's offering, and took the goat, which was the sin offering for the people, and slew it, and offered it for sin, as the first.
9:16 And he brought the burnt offering, and offered it according to the manner.
9:17 And he brought the meat offering, and took an handful thereof, and burnt it upon the altar, beside the burnt sacrifice of the morning.
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Do da do, herpy derp.
When I minister to God, it's by offering love toward God.
You like back to the Future, God? That's a good-hearted movie. You could endorse it.
God says...
1:7 So that ye were ensamples to all that believe in Macedonia and Achaia.
1:8 For from you sounded out the word of the Lord not only in Macedonia and Achaia, but also in every place your faith to God-ward is spread abroad; so that we need not to speak any thing.
1:9 For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God; 1:10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.
2:1 For yourselves, brethren, know our entrance in unto you, that it was not in vain: 2:2 But even after that we had suffered before, and were shamefully entreated, as ye know, at Philippi, we were bold in our God to speak unto you the gospel of God with much contention.
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I like this:
http://harkavagrant.com/index.php?id=296
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I prolly won't vote.
Tell us about dinosaurs!
Any unanticipated problems scaling dino bones?
God says...
C:\Text\WEALTH.TXT
quantity, the value, to wit, of two or three oxen, or of two or three sheep. If, on the contrary, instead of sheep or oxen, he had metals to give in exchange for it, he could easily proportion the quantity of the metal to the precise quantity of the commodity which he had immediate occasion for.
Different metals have been made use of by different nations for this purpose. Iron was the common instrument of commerce among the ancient Spartans, copper among the ancient Romans, and gold and silver amo
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Gold ammo is the Bible. Silver is everything else. :-)
What do You think of the Alamo?
God says...
increasing thrust wine-bibbing execrate familiarly production rich Curiosity offence subvertings alleging longing pain sink I_forgot distributing delightfulness burial unacquainted melodies relief rebel wood desiring presume presented catch alter reformed joint imperishable disciple suggestions unpunished disquiet madly digest constituteth //ftp alteration urgedst tcosa10a pines condensed estate Commandment second runs stricken peaceful Grecian 12/12/00 secrecies do_you_know_what_time_it_is stanzas Eternal empty assent eight save altered vapours phantom boink sky Whose charges disperseth glittering regarded ideas taught copied slumber four lulled their