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Apple must pay 13B euros in back taxes, EU's top court rules

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Re: Apple must pay 13B euros in back taxes, EU's top court rules

#141

Post by piltdownman »

quonn wrote: post #127
piltdownman wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not how the EU works. To give just one major example, our constitution regularly overrules EU law - Ireland has to go to referendum for Treaties - e.g. The Lisbon Treaty.

EU law has precedence, period.

No, no it doesn't. The primacy of EU law is completely negated in a number of fairly basic instances - the common market first and foremost.

Specifically for Ireland, we are the only EU member state that are obliged to hold public referendums on Treaties. Ratification of the Treaty in all other member states is decided upon by the states' national parliaments.

Ireland, Netherlands, and Luxembourg also have veto powers when it comes to EU wide regulations. That's why Article 116 exists. You don't know what you're talking about.

Re: Apple must pay 13B euros in back taxes, EU's top court rules

#142

Post by lm28469 »

SanjayMehta wrote: post #104
lm28469 wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you think a political and economical union does exactly ?

Lose sovereignty, it appears. Strange.

Yeah very strange... people get together, vote laws, and respect the laws they voted... how strange indeed

You can be for or against the EU but none of that is strange lmao. You can't play the game for the nice rules and say "no" when the rules you don't like affect you

Re: Apple must pay 13B euros in back taxes, EU's top court rules

#143

Post by Macha »

librasteve wrote: post #118
librasteve wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

will do

btw I think I got the idea that its the official name from the word Éire being stamped on all the coins

There was also a long tradition of the British government (and by extension, the BBC) using Eire as they didn't want to acknowledge the name Ireland in case it was seen as a recognition of claims on Northern Ireland. Since the Good Friday Agreement in the 90s however, that was resolved, and now even the British government uses Ireland and most style guides in the UK media advise people away from "Eire" (It slips through occasionally though).

Re: Apple must pay 13B euros in back taxes, EU's top court rules

#144

Post by Rinzler89 »

izacus wrote: post #134
Rinzler89 wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because getting even And that's the problem right there. It's a constant race to the bottom between EU states where the EU taxpayers are the loosers and the corpos are the winners.

Would it be really 0%? Is there any grounds for that? Those companies are based in Ireland due to IP law, not tax law.

Can't companies abuse the IP law to wash other profits as IP costs?

Re: Apple must pay 13B euros in back taxes, EU's top court rules

#146

Post by lm28469 »

SanjayMehta wrote: post #116
Woeps wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the EU checks if the tax systems are fair and held to certain standards. In this case this special deal was only available to a select few companies.

Were these companies selected on the basis on employment numbers or revenue? AFAIK Apple doesn’t have so many employees in Ireland that would generate enough revenue for a 13B tax bill. So they must have been booking offshore revenue via an Irish subsidiary. When I buy software licenses here in India I’ve noticed that the billing almost always is in Ireland.

Ireland doesn't produce anything of value by itself, it's full of ghost offices claiming revenues for the entire EU market.

Re: Apple must pay 13B euros in back taxes, EU's top court rules

#147

Post by moomin »

RickarySanchez wrote: post #37
whacko_quacko wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not, because Ireland chose to be part of the EU which its actions are undermining. Also, we accept the fact that in capitalism companies have the goal to maximize profit, but the purpose of a country is not to maximize tax income compared to others

Yeah the purpose of a country is to maximize the opportunity of its citizens which is exactly what Ireland is doing. They're not trying to maximize tax income otherwise they would have a higher rate

And it is welcome to leave the EU and cut whatever deals they like if they think that's gonna benefit their citizens. But they're not going to do that, because the value of being in the EU vastly outstrips the inconvenience of this judgement.

Re: Apple must pay 13B euros in back taxes, EU's top court rules

#148

Post by Supernaut »

dist-epoch wrote: post #80
robertlagrant wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the EU specifically set up to allow competition between states on tax grounds?

Selling phones in Poland and paying taxes in Ireland is not competition, it's tax arbitrage.

That's... literally how every company in the EU operates. If Volkswagen, incorporated in Germany, sells a car in Poland, they're not required to pay a corresponding sliver of their net profits to the Polish exchequer. It all stays in Germany.

Re: Apple must pay 13B euros in back taxes, EU's top court rules

#149

Post by izacus »

dylanredm0nd wrote: post #111
izacus wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you explain where exactly did Ireland gain benefit from not collecting these taxes?

The jobs provided via Apple, FDI in Ireland, Tax paid by apple staff in Ireland... general spend?

There is just a tiny count employees in Ireland, mostly legal to run the sandwitch.

Re: Apple must pay 13B euros in back taxes, EU's top court rules

#150

Post by izacus »

piltdownman wrote: post #141
quonn wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU law has precedence, period.

No, no it doesn't. The primacy of EU law is completely negated in a number of fairly basic instances - the common market first and foremost. Specifically for Ireland, we are the only EU member state that are obliged to hold public referendums on Treaties. Ratification of the Treaty in all other member states is decided upon by the states' national parliaments. Ireland, Netherlands, and Luxembourg also have veto power…

Your interpretation just lost in court, so who here doesn't know what they're talking about?
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