Taming the beast that is the Django ORM – An introduction • Hacker News Board

Re: Taming the beast that is the Django ORM – An introduction

#141

Post by za3faran » Tue, Sep 03, 2024, 5:52 AM UTC

juahan wrote: post #60

exceptione wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is one part in me that says to not destroy your positive mood, there is another part in me that wishes to yell at the pythonistas in general to look outside the Python world. Too often I come across Python projects that are hyped and when I dive into it I find it rather underwhelming to say it politely. Invariably it turns out that those people don´t know any other language than Python. I see that as a general…

How are those better?

Statically typed languages, performance, refactorability, instrospection, debuggability, observability, the list goes on.

Re: Taming the beast that is the Django ORM – An introduction

#142

Post by nprateem » Tue, Sep 03, 2024, 11:01 AM UTC

ruthmarx wrote: post #138

nprateem wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or just read the code like I would if a colleague had written it, or do you think it's chucking out assembler?

What good will reading the code do you when by your own admission you can't understand it?

I said I couldn't write it, not that I suddenly became unable to reason or understand programming.

Re: Taming the beast that is the Django ORM – An introduction

#143

Post by ruthmarx » Tue, Sep 03, 2024, 3:38 PM UTC

nprateem wrote: post #142

ruthmarx wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What good will reading the code do you when by your own admission you can't understand it?

I said I couldn't write it, not that I suddenly became unable to reason or understand programming.

You said you had no interest in learning it.

If you didn't learn it, you don't know it.

It doesn't matter if you can reason or 'understand programming' if you haven't learned what is necessary to understand this particular piece of programming.

Or is it that you think you can 'reason or understand' any piece of programming? And you possibly assume that is easier, to read what an LLM generates rather learning what is necessary to write it yourself?

Re: Taming the beast that is the Django ORM – An introduction

#144

Post by reaanb2 » Thu, Sep 05, 2024, 9:44 PM UTC

eru wrote: post #130

bal00ns wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They’re incredibly convenient. It allows smaller groups of people to accomplish more in a shorter amount of time by providing a standardized interface that does a great job of integrating with their existing environment. When translating database input and output into server-side representations, you have two options: build and maintain the process yourself or use a mature tool designed for that specific purpose in y…

> When translating database input and output into server-side representations, [...] I'm saying that your server side representation could also be done as a relation. No need for object orientation. I don't have a problem with the M part of ORM, but with the O part. _If_ you are having different representations, than having an automated mapper between representations is good. Agreed, yes.

A more appropriate name for ORMs would be "network data model to SQL mappers". They don't facilitate good OOP and oppose relational thinking and data management.