Why isn't Java used for modern web application development?

Post by irahul » Sun, Jun 10, 2012, 3:49 PM UTC

rabbitfang wrote: post #140

irahul wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Higher quality code. Java is easier to refactor than Ruby, which makes up for the lower language power. Let me rephrase: "It's easier in Java to rename identifiers than ruby, because my IDE does it for me." Now that's fine, but I don't see how do you conclude: Easier to rename identifiers => Higher quality code. How on earth? Easier to rename identifiers => Makes up for lower language power. What language deficienc…

You do realise there is more than "renaming variables" to refactoring don't you?!?

Post by mibbitier » Sun, Jun 10, 2012, 3:53 PM UTC

pi18n wrote: post #126

mibbitier wrote: post #104

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I grew up reading assembly code listings. Being able to read code is a really really important skill IMHO. Something like Java is very very easy to read. It's mainly keyword based, rather than special character based. I'd much rather read a 1,000 line Java program, than a 100 line program. The other point I'd make is that Java is probably about as verbose as english is. But we all manage, using English. We don't moan…

You'd much rather read a Java program because you are already biased towards it. Yes it's easy to read, but you need to acknowledge that many other skilled developers would find it easier to read Python, or Ruby, and indeed would rather read 1,000 lines of the same over 100 lines of Java. Otherwise you are simply being willfully ignorant. Why is Java considered inefficient and English not? Maybe because we don't need…

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Jun 10, 2012, 4:01 PM UTC

pkaler wrote: post #35

Java is a language that is in a weird space. It doesn't compile to binary like C/C++ and it isn't high-level and interpreted like a Ruby or Python. It's a weird middle-times language. It originally appeared in 1995 and is somewhat pioneering in the web space. But it isn't as clean as C# since C# appeared in 2001 and was able to learn from the mistakes of Java. It's definitely not as clean as Go which appeared in abou…

Post by chc » Sun, Jun 10, 2012, 4:08 PM UTC

patio11 wrote: post #43

I spent three long years doing Big Freaking Enterprise Java web apps. You can certainly do modern web dev in a Java stack (we were Struts, Hibernate, Spring, and an internal framework). It just fought us every single step of the way, and every time we had to do something new (that couldn't be templates off of working code) they'd have to get one of our three best engineers to spend a week fighting the new library int…

Post by derleth » Sun, Jun 10, 2012, 4:18 PM UTC

mibbitier wrote: post #106

derleth wrote: post #87

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Actually, with Java, I type more than I think. A lot more. Compare this to Haskell, where a single keyword might involve substantial thought, or APL, where one character more or less could represent a pretty fundamental restructuring of part of the program. That Java makes you repeat yourself is not controversial. That being averse to this means you dislike thought is a somewhat bizarre position to hold.

> That Java makes you repeat yourself is not controversial. That being averse to this means you dislike thought is a somewhat bizarre position to hold. The English language makes you repeat yourself. I don't see it as a bottleneck. I've never considered a bottleneck to programming. possibly when programming some assembly routines. But if you're typing too much, you're probably repeating yourself too much, which means…