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How many photons are received per bit transmitted from Voyager 1?

physics.stackexchange.com

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Re: How many photons are received per bit transmitted from Voyager 1?

#141
post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's because unintended measurement is a type of error in a quantum computer. Like, if an electron passing near your qubit would get pushed left if your qubit was 0 and right if was 1, then you will see errors when electrons pass by. Repeating the 0 or 1 a thousand times just means there's 1000x more places that electrons passing by would cause a problem. That kind of redundancy makes that kind of error mechanism wor…

Is this the correct interpretation? Classical systems: You measure some state, with the measurement containing some error. Averaging the measurement error usually gets closer to the actual value. Quantum systems: Your measurement influences/can influence the state, which can cause an error in the state itself. Multiple measurements means more possible influence.

Yeah that's roughly it. In classical computers all errors can be simplified as being bit flip errors (0 instead of 1, 1 instead of 0). Like, power loss is a lot of bit flip errors that happened to target the bits that should have been 1. In quantum computers this simplification does not work, there is another type of error called a phase flip. Measurements cause phase flip errors. You can exchange the phase flip and bit flip bases by using a gate called the Hadamard gate. So if you surround measurements with Hadamard gates, you will see bit flip errors. The existence of gates like Hadamard is what makes it possible to see these kinds of things at all, and correspondingly its availability can be thought of as the thing that makes a quantum computer a quantum computer, instead of a classical computer.

Re: How many photons are received per bit transmitted from Voyager 1?

#142
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine it'd certainly employ some type of beamforming at the least.

Assuming you don't need fast steering, is a 3.7m transmitter array doing beamforming really better than a 3.7m dish transmitting at the same power? My intuition would have been that you are better off using a fairly standard transceiver and spending your engineering budget either increasing power or getting a bigger dish (either by launching on a wider rocket or with a folding design). Lasers might interesting for th…

The array doing beamforming can be spread out much farther. If the DSN were being built now, I'd think its antennas would look more like the Square Kilometer Array.

Re: How many photons are received per bit transmitted from Voyager 1?

#143

For anyone who is interested in the ultimate limits to communications the seminal paper by Jim Gordon is quite easy to understand even without a physics degree (unlike the Holevo paper IMO). He was incredibly good at writing in an accessible manner (apart from probably being the person who most deserved a Nobel prize but didn't get it). https://doi.org/10.1109%2FJRPROC.1962.288169

> probably being the person who most deserved a Nobel prize but didn't get it

You probably want to read up a bit on the remarkable life of Lise Meitner.

Re: How many photons are received per bit transmitted from Voyager 1?

#145
post #119

Super interesting! But I feel like there is a bit of a conclusion missing for me. So 1500 Photons hit the receiver per bit send, but this is obviously way to few to keep processing the signal and it will just be drowned out by noise? Where do we go from here? Does voyager repeat its signal gazillions of times so we can average out the noise on our end? Where can I find more information on what is done with these few…

No, those 1500 photons are enough and we basically read the signal from them, from my reading of the comments here.

Re: How many photons are received per bit transmitted from Voyager 1?

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, but: he's still understudied. I think in retrospect any 21st-century math course has to include Shannon, and they don't all, yet.

On some level he's a victim of his own success. He invents information theory in the same paper that proves the most interesting results, so who else will work on it?

Shannon: "I'm about to make and end this field's whole career."

Re: How many photons are received per bit transmitted from Voyager 1?

#147
post #144

Wow, I never thought about how Voyager communicates with Earth. But now I wonder: if Voyager just sends photons towards the Earth, at the receiving end how are we recognizing which photons are coming from Voyager and how is the "signal" decoded?

Two main reasons for recognizing the photons: They have a specific frequency, 8.3GHz in this example. It's like tuning an FM radio to a station. The photons are coming from a specific direction.

As to how they are decoded, you'll need to understand some modulation techniques.

Re: How many photons are received per bit transmitted from Voyager 1?

#148
What is equally impressive is the number of photons received from radar imaging of asteroids.

They are closer, but the radar equation received power is inversely proportional to range to the fourth power, not range squared as with Voyager.

Anything proportional to 1/R^4 degrades very quickly.

Re: How many photons are received per bit transmitted from Voyager 1?

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assuming you don't need fast steering, is a 3.7m transmitter array doing beamforming really better than a 3.7m dish transmitting at the same power? My intuition would have been that you are better off using a fairly standard transceiver and spending your engineering budget either increasing power or getting a bigger dish (either by launching on a wider rocket or with a folding design). Lasers might interesting for th…

The array doing beamforming can be spread out much farther. If the DSN were being built now, I'd think its antennas would look more like the Square Kilometer Array.

Seems they're already on to something like that[1][2]:

We envision deployment in three sites at or near the longitudes of the existing DSN sites.

As an example, a potential initial phase could deploy 40 12-m elements at each complex to duplicate the X-band performance of a DSN 70-m antenna.

Second and third phase deployments may bring the number of 12-m antennas to 200, then perhaps 400 per complex.

[1]: https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/4374100

[2]: https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/4374103

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