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It's not what the world needs right now

thebaffler.com

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Re: It's not what the world needs right now

#141

Post by hattmall »

jyunwai wrote: post #31

Most other comments so far have viewed this artist's lifestyle negatively, as he wrote that he got by via abusing various policies and tax fraud (via "[hallucinating] a DJ software skin" to claim as a business expense). But he's an interesting person for sticking to his craft for close to a decade now: he has persisted in working hard to produce artwork and submit it for exhibition. However, to what extent is this li…

I don't think the lifestyle is related to the art but the person. I have friends with similar lifestyles and stories even down to the avoiding homelessness by pet sitting, and being shitty at it. Yet art or any sort of creative endeavor isn't part of the equation. Then I have some friends deeply devoted to their art that wouldn't ever consider approaching homelessness. The most successful artist I know is a landscaper and he could certainly live a successful by any standard life on purely his art but it's just not in his nature to live in that way.

All people, artistic or not, have a certain tolerance for ignoring social standards. Some of the best artists are known to have a very high tolerance. But there's millions more people with similarly chaotic existences that don't care about art and creative activities at all.

Re: It's not what the world needs right now

#142

Post by hattmall »

rebuilder wrote: post #65
jyunwai wrote: post #31

Most other comments so far have viewed this artist's lifestyle negatively, as he wrote that he got by via abusing various policies and tax fraud (via "[hallucinating] a DJ software skin" to claim as a business expense). But he's an interesting person for sticking to his craft for close to a decade now: he has persisted in working hard to produce artwork and submit it for exhibition. However, to what extent is this li…

The common wisdom is , if you’re going to be an artist, it better be because you can be nothing else. It’s that hard. So, it’s a rare person indeed who can be a serious artist and support themselves financially some other way

It's pretty reasonable to make a living if you're a decent painter, musician, or photographer. There's just not a great overlap of art and business skills.

Re: It's not what the world needs right now

#143

Post by hattmall »

bsder wrote: post #100
jyunwai wrote: post #31

Most other comments so far have viewed this artist's lifestyle negatively, as he wrote that he got by via abusing various policies and tax fraud (via "[hallucinating] a DJ software skin" to claim as a business expense). But he's an interesting person for sticking to his craft for close to a decade now: he has persisted in working hard to produce artwork and submit it for exhibition. However, to what extent is this li…

It's pretty sad, actually, how much negative vibe is here. This man is hustle culture personified. What's the problem? Alternatively, he's the epitome of a "disruptor". What's the issue? Oh, perhaps it's that he's holding up a light at what is at the end of the tunnel if we keep going the way society is--complete instability for the peons who are completely at the whim of a small number of the rich.

Homosexual prostitution for drugs is a long way from most people's definition of hustle culture.

Also how is he a disruptor? It seems like he's someone that has been VERY lucky to get opportunities many people strive for and he has fucked them up.

Then he acts like his only options are fraud and theft because there's always someone closing the door on him for being himself.

Re: It's not what the world needs right now

#144

Post by weregiraffe »

labrador wrote: post #75

I used to be similarly lost in the drama of my own life, hanging on to things that I felt made me special. It's an ego trap in my opinion, as there are millions of people around us who have extrodinary lives that we never hear about. The word "sonder" applies: Sonder is defined as the profound feeling of realizing that everyone, including strangers passing by on the street, has a life as complex and vivid as your own…

I always think of Sonderkommandos when I see "sonder" in a page

Re: It's not what the world needs right now

#145

Post by xorvoid »

sandspar wrote: post #21

It's not a lifestyle I'd want to emulate. The author/character does seem to have some kind of moral code, at least. From my reading, it seems like he's OK with harming the "haves" but I didn't notice him harming any "have nots". I'd guess he's Chaotic Neutral alignment. From easydamus.com: "People who are neutral with respect to good and evil have compunctions against killing the innocent but lack the commitment to m…

You don’t have to like the protagonist to enjoy the story. Who said the protagonist had to be the “good guy”. And he makes no claims to be.

Re: It's not what the world needs right now

#146

Post by ChainOfFools »

pavlov wrote: post #43

The essence and moral of this quite wonderful piece: “No one wants to listen to an artist describe their work, but everyone wants to be told my rib story.”

artist fixes rib story = a how-to guide (expressed in the reciprocal "how-did" form) discussing the narrator's passage through a niche and mildly exotic experience. It answers a question the reader never asked, but potentially might have.

whereas artist recounting his struggles = a series of open-ended "why-did" vignettes with none offering escape from a cycle of precarity, except for the obvious solution to discontinue throwing oneself on the sword of Art. a solution which is intentionally and elaborately avoided by a narrator who does not supply a relatable (never mind satisfying) motivation or justification. I may be giving him too much credit, but there's a decent chance the vague sense of being stifled by this brief immersion in a world fundamentally unsuited to your own nature is an intended effect.

Re: It's not what the world needs right now

#147

Post by cess11 »

atoav wrote: post #61
cess11 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would that be risky?

As someone teaching at an art school/university I can assure you that unhealthy drives for art often (but not nearly always!) have hard psychological causes. That brings all kins of hardships with itself, many of those artists live unhealthy, often impoverished, rarely stable lives. And while the romatic view of the impoverished artist is a popular one, these people are rarely as free as they like they would be and I…

Life isn't stable, if it was it wouldn't have managed to stick around for this long. Hundreds of millions of people are impoverished, are they unable to make art?

I'm also not sure what your suggestion is. Should aspiring artists create corporations and live from the labour of other people, to create something you'd consider freedom for themselves while intruding on the freedom of others? Or do you consider it freedom to be in someone else's service under the threat of poverty?

Some people also agree with songs like this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFkmRp_G2uo

Re: It's not what the world needs right now

#148

Post by strken »

dj_mc_merlin wrote: post #63

The fact that so many people on HN dislike this proves hacker culture died in programming..

I liked it. I also think he sounds like a dick and a tiring man to know, and I'm confused by the people who themselves confuse dislike for the person with dislike for the writing.

Re: It's not what the world needs right now

#149

Post by strken »

grzeshru wrote: post #114
smackeyacky wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a great deal to dislike. Primarily he is clearly from an affluent family and all his misery could be solved with a phone call.

What makes it seem like, from this piece anyway, that he is from an affluent family? (I don’t know the author/artist whatsoever.) Describe to me the phone call you think ought to take place.

"Hey mum, can I move back into your two-bedroom ranch house in North Carolina?"

"Oh honey, of course you can!"

Note that he did in fact move back in, so this conversation must have happened in some form.

Re: It's not what the world needs right now

#150

Post by atoav »

cess11 wrote: post #147
atoav wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone teaching at an art school/university I can assure you that unhealthy drives for art often (but not nearly always!) have hard psychological causes. That brings all kins of hardships with itself, many of those artists live unhealthy, often impoverished, rarely stable lives. And while the romatic view of the impoverished artist is a popular one, these people are rarely as free as they like they would be and I…

Life isn't stable, if it was it wouldn't have managed to stick around for this long. Hundreds of millions of people are impoverished, are they unable to make art? I'm also not sure what your suggestion is. Should aspiring artists create corporations and live from the labour of other people, to create something you'd consider freedom for themselves while intruding on the freedom of others? Or do you consider it freedo…

I am not sure what you mean, the history of art is a history of rich/powerful people giving poor/lower ranking people money for doing said art. Artists have never been truly free in that sense — thst was my point.

Sure the art scene in parts has become entrepreneurial, but quite frankly most commercial art is either tasteless shit for tasteless customers, the works of old artists who are two decades away from dying or the works of a popular one-trick-pony on borrowed time. Who has a more hard time here are the newcomers or people who are doing it to hold up a mirror to society. But your society won't get the artists that are two decades from dying if they didn't make it somehow up to that point.

Now I gladly live in a european nation where society means that we look out for each other and I'd have no problem if more of my tax money goes towards culture. Now I know the sentiment towards commons and investing in your own infrastructure and society is way different in the US, but I don't even see it that way. I profit from the money I put there by being allowed to live in a society where people can dare to try things that are the opposite of commercial no-brainers.

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