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'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

aljazeera.com

141–150 of 1001 posts

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#141
post #96
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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" I am talking about women/children. " Can you elaborate, what makes especially women special as a victim?

The vast majority of combatants are male, so women and children are typically viewed as non-combatants by default.

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#143
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you provide examples where they've been debunked?

Where it crystalized for me was watching https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Ahli_Arab_Hospital_explosio... as it happened live. The AJ coverage: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2023/10/16/israel-ha... From reading the AJ coverage, you would believe that Israel bombed a hospital and killed hundreds. An inexcusable atrocity, obviously, if it were true. But on Wikipedia, you can see the actual impact of the bombin…

Al Jazeera was not unique in their short-term coverage - nearly all western outlets also wrote similar articles shortly afterward, based mainly on unsupported statements from Palestinians. As soon as day broke and people saw the actual photos of the impact area it was clearer that attributing the attack to either side would be challenging; several reputable outfits in the US even wrote short postmortems to understand why they did what they did and to prevent it in the future.

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#144

My political awareness was forged by the 9/11 terrorist attacks and the American response. The core lesson: the point of a terrorist attack is to trigger an over reaction. America wildly over reacted and became fundamentally hostile to Arab and Muslim people. This reaction led to some of the most successful recruiting of radicals in generations. Israel's response to this crisis seems to have failed to learn from that…

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Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#146
post #54

Israel has also been imposing apartheid on Palestinians for years, a fact that high-ranking officials themselves admit [1][2], and which human rights reports confirm[3]. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/sep/06/israel-imposin... [2] https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-08-13/ty-article/ex... [3] https://www.hrw.org/report/2021/04/27/threshold-crossed/isra...

It seems that in Israel there are (very small) quotas for non jewish people to be admitted at university.

I've met muslim israeli who have learnt italian to go to study medicine in italy (where there is a notoriously extremely difficult entrance exam) because all of this was easier than going to a local university.

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#147
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

re: 1. the aggression is still happening, Hamas is still launching rockets into Israel, so I'd personally say this is Israel defending itself

They have been firing rockets for decades. They killed 28 people over 20 years with 20k+ rockets[1]. Israel killed 17 000 people in two months. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_...

You are reading very selectively (and I think fir a reason):

> From 2004 to 2014, these attacks have killed 27 Israeli civilians, 5 foreign nationals, 5 IDF soldiers, and at least 11 Palestinians[11] and injured more than 1900 people.[12] Their main effect is their creation of widespread psychological trauma and disruption of daily life among the Israeli populace.

Please at least try to stay true to the facts, even if you are not willing to steelman the other's arguments.

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#148

Those are the most serious allegations: "The men and teenage boys were taken to a warehouse where they sat on a bare floor covered in scattered grains of rice. There they were beaten, interrogated and verbally abused. There was no sleep, and the grains of rice cut their skin as they sat there, undressed." A man claims: "Some people didn’t return from the torture sessions. We would hear their screams and then nothing.…

I think the self-defense discussion is more of a PR talking point, intl law is pretty clear on the rights and responsibilties of occupying powers.

That said, we seem to be entering a new world order where international law means nothing at all.

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#149
post #136

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I always saw it as the Israel-Palestine conflict has been ongoing for 75+ years with no resolution. It's a conflict that's symbolic of the deep divide of the historical imperial powers and the Global south that suffered from colonialism. I feel this is why people in different continents of the world react so differently to the conflict and why many find it so interesting.

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#150

My political awareness was forged by the 9/11 terrorist attacks and the American response. The core lesson: the point of a terrorist attack is to trigger an over reaction. America wildly over reacted and became fundamentally hostile to Arab and Muslim people. This reaction led to some of the most successful recruiting of radicals in generations. Israel's response to this crisis seems to have failed to learn from that…

All reports are that Netanyahu and the Israeli intelligence services knew this attack was coming. They've been promoting Hamas over more moderate elements in Gaza. The goal was to provoke an attack which would "justify" a counter-attack to completely level Gaza and kill or force out all the remaining civilians.

While there are elements of truth to this, the reality is more nuanced. They have been promoting Hamas over moderate elements, and have looked the other way as Qatar has provided money in briefcases to Hamas. Israel ignored warnings from their own intel as well as civilians who noticed that Hamas were increasing training exercises on the border from listening to radio communications. The explicit goal of promoting Hamas was not to promote an attack, but to divide and rule the Palestinians: by showing Hamas as an example of "this is what would happen if we left the West Bank" and by exacerbating the rivalry, they used this to exert control over the Palestinian Authority.

https://www.thenation.com/article/world/why-netanyahu-bolste...

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