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UPI Payments: 10B transactions a month done, next stop 100B

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141–150 of 399 posts

Re: UPI Payments: 10B transactions a month done, next stop 100B

#141
post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

a lot more seamless. you just tap your credit card and that’s it.

This exists in India too. But people don't use it. Why take on debt if you don't need to? UPI is directly connected to your bank account. It does not go through VISA, Mastercard or whatever.

> Why take on debt if you don't need to?

what debt?

> UPI is directly connected to your bank account.

oh, then it's a hard pass from me. i do not connect anything to my bank account and keep cards in separate banks for security.

Re: UPI Payments: 10B transactions a month done, next stop 100B

#142

Many countries have a single dominant privately owned e-cash system. The only alternative to a future with centralized financial systems, where the individual's right to transact won't be at the total mercy of the whims of forces they don't control (e.g. a corporation which deems their credit risk as unacceptably high, a political zeitgeist that deems their unwillingness to get vaccinated as making them deserving fin…

While I agree with many of your points, in this context, UPI is just a money transfer platform. It’s not currency or a currency equivalent of any sort.

There is a CBDC (Central Bank Digital Currency) in a pilot phase in India since last year.

Re: UPI Payments: 10B transactions a month done, next stop 100B

#143
I really really don't care what cash transfer app we go with, I just want to only have one app and for it to NEVER change.

Ideally, there would be regulated advisarial integration between the apps. That way if you had venmo and they had cashapp, it would still work!

Let these companies compete on UX and financial instruments, not creating a walled garden of users and hoping they get the most inertia.

We made it work with phone networks, I think we could handle this.

Re: UPI Payments: 10B transactions a month done, next stop 100B

#144
post #118

UPI is one of the best payment systems invented and in under 10 years has more transactions, use cases and ease of use than cryptocurrencies which is clearly terrible for payments. This shows that UPI has the potential to scale beyond India yet crypto cannot scale at all.

They are fundamentally different.

[deleted]

Re: UPI Payments: 10B transactions a month done, next stop 100B

#145
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The interop with banking across SEA is pretty cool now, most countries have cross border payments with nothing more than a QR code. And this is down to the hawker stall level. It's advancing a lot quicker than you'd expect given that many of the countries aren't really that good at coordinating with each other.

why didn’t these countries go the NFC route instead of QR codes?

thank you all for replying. i now understand a bit better why they went the QR route.

Re: UPI Payments: 10B transactions a month done, next stop 100B

#146
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All countries of SEA have similar systems (even Laos and Cambodia). The one managed by Malaysia now can work in Thailand, Singapore and Indonesia too. I think in the next 3-4 years, these wallets will support inter-change across all ASEAN.

Seems like it's a good example of developing countries skipping technological nodes and ending up with better solutions. For example, most of eastern Europe was already using fiber/copper Ethernet 15-20 years ago, while most western Europe and US were stuck with crappy DSL lines. In the payment processing sphere, we are stuck with a duopoly that charges insane fees for something that was very complex and labor intens…

But is QR Code scanning a better solution? Credit card cloning only affect the legacy magnetic strip I think?

Someone can just stick a QR code on top of the office one. [1]

[1]: https://www.straitstimes.com/tech/can-i-trust-this-qr-code-c...

Re: UPI Payments: 10B transactions a month done, next stop 100B

#147

UPI is one of the best payment systems invented and in under 10 years has more transactions, use cases and ease of use than cryptocurrencies which is clearly terrible for payments. This shows that UPI has the potential to scale beyond India yet crypto cannot scale at all.

As we see more of these payment systems emerge, crypto will become more important. The thing about large centralized systems it that sooner or later, they will end up with more virtual units than they can back with real currency and there will be a run on these platforms. History may not repeat itself, but it rhymes. Centralized systems are inherently unreliable and impossible to reliably audit as they can self-report anything. Whatever that single database system reports is treated as true, end of story. Nobody else can verify or contest.

The fiat monetary system is itself just made up of a large number of centralized banking systems which have probably issued more units than they claim/believe. But the critical difference from private payment systems is that because the banking systems are treated as the sources of truth to represent the national currency, they can never run out of units. The way this problem will manifest itself is probably through inflation as the banks will have all these new currency units being created out of thin air due to thousands of different system flaws or exploits across thousands of different systems... These counterfeited digital units will be accepted as payment just like legitimate digital units; there will be no way to tell the difference as all the banks inherently trust each other (see correspondent banking). Essentially, fraudsters will control much of the new money minted by various centralized systems which will give them a lot of power in the markets.

The reason why crypto is important is that it's publicly auditable and cannot be counterfeited (neither accidentally nor intentionally). I believe that eventually, most economic participants will not be able to get a hold of the national fiat currency no matter how hard they work or how valuable their work is but some other people will have no difficulty getting hold of that fiat currency and they won't work at all (they won't need to). This contrast is going to be the catalyst that causes people to move to crypto as it will cause hyperinflation due to large fiat holders being unproductive members of society and crypto holders being comparatively productive.

Re: UPI Payments: 10B transactions a month done, next stop 100B

#148

I was in India earlier this year, and found there was no way (and I spent hours trying) for a foreigner to get access to the UPI system. This meant: 1) There were some cashless fast food outlets that I couldn't eat at 2) There was no way for me to book an intercity bus ticket I eventually managed to get a bus ticket by sweet-talking someone in a shop to use their personal UPI account in exchange for cash. I fear ther…

I have not seen a single eatery that does not accept cash.

Booking bus tickets - RedBus and other portals accept credit cards. To use cash one must book at the terminal.

Re: UPI Payments: 10B transactions a month done, next stop 100B

#149

I really really don't care what cash transfer app we go with, I just want to only have one app and for it to NEVER change. Ideally, there would be regulated advisarial integration between the apps. That way if you had venmo and they had cashapp, it would still work! Let these companies compete on UX and financial instruments, not creating a walled garden of users and hoping they get the most inertia. We made it work…

For UPI, which is created and run by NPCI (an organization comprising a consortium of private and public banks), there is an “official” app called BHIM (Bharat Interface for Money). Anyone who has it doesn’t have to worry if the other person is using Google Pay or WhatsApp Pay or another app. Banks also have their own UPI apps or include the UPI feature in their banking app. All these apps work on the same platform, which is UPI, which in turn is supported by all banks.

Re: UPI Payments: 10B transactions a month done, next stop 100B

#150

I really really don't care what cash transfer app we go with, I just want to only have one app and for it to NEVER change. Ideally, there would be regulated advisarial integration between the apps. That way if you had venmo and they had cashapp, it would still work! Let these companies compete on UX and financial instruments, not creating a walled garden of users and hoping they get the most inertia. We made it work…

I've not used any third party UPIs. I've been using BHIM UPI since 2020 _almost_ without issues.
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