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256TB SSD from Samsung

semiconductor.samsung.com

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Re: 256TB SSD from Samsung

#141

Post by drtgh »

wtallis wrote: post #137
drtgh wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think they crossed the limit of sacrifice that is understandable given the endurance of the materials currently used in NAND. Cell modes are done by charging a cell to a level on write, and measuring the voltage on read. The more bits per cell, the more voltage divisions, and the sooner these voltages divisions turns unreadable, while the material degrades. Technically is on the manufacturer's firmware to decide wh…

> So IMHO, they are not giving more capacity, due that capacity is going to be consumed for to try to keep alive the data. If one fills the QLC disk of the article for long term storage, bad things will happen, as I understand it. Your opinion aside, QLC drives really do offer more capacity for your dollar, and the extra write cycles necessary to stave off data degradation do not render the drives useless. You absolu…

> but consumer QLC drives have now been on the market for five years: the time limit on those drive warranties is now expiring, with no sign of an epidemic of premature drive failures

The failure is not shown as an epidemic, it is shown firstly as a degradation; in forums under questions about why turned so slow the disk that find as answer to enable the RAPID mode (so using RAM cache), in other post as regrets about the purchase, and things like that.

those who know what kind of thing they are buying with QLC store disposable data, at time they do not fill the disk.

Re: 256TB SSD from Samsung

#142

Post by wtallis »

drtgh wrote: post #141
wtallis wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So IMHO, they are not giving more capacity, due that capacity is going to be consumed for to try to keep alive the data. If one fills the QLC disk of the article for long term storage, bad things will happen, as I understand it. Your opinion aside, QLC drives really do offer more capacity for your dollar, and the extra write cycles necessary to stave off data degradation do not render the drives useless. You absolu…

> but consumer QLC drives have now been on the market for five years: the time limit on those drive warranties is now expiring, with no sign of an epidemic of premature drive failures The failure is not shown as an epidemic, it is shown firstly as a degradation; in forums under questions about why turned so slow the disk that find as answer to enable the RAPID mode (so using RAM cache), in other post as regrets about…

I really don't see how conflating performance problems with data retention problems helps illustrate your point.

Re: 256TB SSD from Samsung

#143

Post by drtgh »

wtallis wrote: post #142
drtgh wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but consumer QLC drives have now been on the market for five years: the time limit on those drive warranties is now expiring, with no sign of an epidemic of premature drive failures The failure is not shown as an epidemic, it is shown firstly as a degradation; in forums under questions about why turned so slow the disk that find as answer to enable the RAPID mode (so using RAM cache), in other post as regrets about…

I really don't see how conflating performance problems with data retention problems helps illustrate your point.

Firstly arise the performance problem, if one keeps using it comes the data progressive loss, those are the ones at forums talking about high trim data errors.

Re: 256TB SSD from Samsung

#145

Post by oneTbrain23 »

ipqk wrote: post #43
haunter wrote: post #37

I was looking for some 8TB m2 drives recently and they are still surprisingly expensive, considering you can get 2TB ones on sale for less than $100. But there are barely any options too, still a niche market https://pcpartpicker.com/products/internal-hard-drive/#A=600...

Those $100 2TB drives are probably because of this: https://www.theverge.com/22291828/sandisk-extreme-pro-portab...

I had that Sandisk 3 years ago. Same thing happened to me. Lost a lot of data. Now, I banned anything by Sandisk and even evangelized anything but Sandisk - probably a couple 10mils of Sandisk revenue averted. I'm surprised, 3 years after, Sandisk SSD extreme STILL has same problem. Now probably easier to say "I told you so".

Re: 256TB SSD from Samsung

#146

Post by i8comments »

justinclift wrote: post #120
httpz wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think with the rise of streaming and cloud storage, the need for large storage devices on a personal level is really declining for most people.

Alternatively, with the ever increasing exploiting of online providers, and the ongoing government led attacks on secure encryption, then maybe personal/local storage will turn out to be the smarter option after all. ;)

Dont get lulled into a false sense of privacy, the governments can and will hack anything connected to the Internet, sometimes illegally for trivial or whimsical reasons.

Re: 256TB SSD from Samsung

#147

Post by bradknowles »

jimt1234 wrote: post #21
twerkmonsta wrote: post #3

Are there actual situations where you would even want this much data on a single drive?

I bought my first HDD in the mid-90s: 850MB. There was a 1.2GB model, but I thought, "Why would I ever need that much space?" This was before videos, before mp3s, and images were all low quality jpegs.

Back in the summer of 1989, I did an internship at Imprimis (later bought by Seagate). The big thing they launched that summer was the Wren VII hard drive, which was the first consumer hard drive with 1GB of storage. It was massive!

I learned a lot about Statistical Quality Control that summer, and built them some tools for improving their SQC across all their models.

Re: 256TB SSD from Samsung

#148

Post by LazyMans »

noitpmeder wrote: post #93
LazyMans wrote: post #39

Would love 2 of these in my nas. My spinning drives are going on 8yr old now and starting to get noisy. Not mention the entire thing is heavy.

How often are you moving your NAS?

Hah! Not often, but I do have to shift it around to clean the fans every few months. It's in a big ole tower case. Have 8 drives. It's a bear.

Re: 256TB SSD from Samsung

#149

Post by [deleted] »

drtgh wrote: post #143
wtallis wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really don't see how conflating performance problems with data retention problems helps illustrate your point.

Firstly arise the performance problem, if one keeps using it comes the data progressive loss, those are the ones at forums talking about high trim data errors.

[deleted]

Re: 256TB SSD from Samsung

#150

Post by drtgh »

drtgh wrote: post #143
wtallis wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really don't see how conflating performance problems with data retention problems helps illustrate your point.

Firstly arise the performance problem, if one keeps using it comes the data progressive loss, those are the ones at forums talking about high trim data errors.

[2018] doi.org/10.1145/3224432 https://people.inf.ethz.ch/omutlu/pub/3D-NAND-flash-lifetime...

[2021] doi.org/10.1145/3445814.3446733 (use sci-hub)

" 3D NAND density-increasing techniques, such as extensive stacking of cell layers, can amplify read disturbances and shorten SSD lifetime. From our lifetime-impact characterization on 8 state-of-the-art SSDs, we observe that the 3D TLC/QLC SSDs can be worn-out by low read-only workloads within their warranty period since a huge amount of read disturbance-induced rewrites are performed in the background. "

[..]

" the SSDs entered an era where one can wear out an SSD by simply reading it. "

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